TargetTalk

I got the book "Way of the Rifle' as a Christmas guift. i also got a book on Bench rest shooting.

After perusing both books and reading that which I had found immediately interesting, I made an observation. Had me one of them epifinies. Lie in the old catroon drawings, a light bulb came above my head.

In the book "Way of the Rifle" there were no fat old shooters pictured. There were not even any pictured in the background of any of the group photos.

Having tried to apply some of the information on position for standing 10 m rifle, I found that there was no way that my elbow was gonna get near the top of my hip bone. At 5'11" and 235 Pounds, with short arms, I can touch the top of my hip bone with my elbow, but there is no way I can make the rifle point at the target in this configuration.

In the book on Bench Rest shooting there were a lot of middle aged "substantial" men. Most of the pictures show these men apparently having a good time.

I wonder if this is what happens to fat men over, say 50 years of age. They become bench rest shooters. I enjoy shooting form a bench once in a while.

"So, what's your point Bubba?", you ask. Well, the point is that maybe fat men can't shoot without a bench. I wish to shoot both ways at my whim.

So, the plan is to loose weight, only about 70 pounds, based on a chart that the government puts out. This would be abiding by my cardiologist's, by GP and the other specialists that have had a shot at getting rich keeping me alive, advise.

I don't know if this can be done. I have not weighed 160 pounds since about my freshman year in high school. Ant that was a long time ago. Is it possible that the very fact that a person is over weight and has been for a long time, evidense of a shortcomming in personality that is not condusive to standing rifle shooting. Could it be that obisity reflects a flaw in personality that is a form of lack of commitment, or a tendency to not be diciplined enough to do well as a shooter?

In the past few years, I have learned to look within for problems I encounter with 10 m pistol. Before that I traded guns often, looking for the magic combination, and found that it was not usually the gun that was the problem. I have applied the same thinking to 10 m rilfe.

Gonna loose some weight and continue and increase my exercise. We'll see how this affects my standing rifle scores.

I do not want to paint a picture of of disillusionment and defeat here. I am not affected by either. I encourage other currently fat old shooters to stand up and shoot. Perhaps the love of the sport will cause a change in attitude.
Further, I figgure that even if I do loose weight and tone up, I still can shoot bench rest. Those guys (bench rest shooters) seem to be interested in the rifle and score more than the shooter anyway.

If anybody knows of a fat old 10 m rilfe or any other standing rifle dicipline shooter, I'd like to know about it. If there are any winning overweight standing rifle shooters, somebody needs to take their picture to prove the existance of such a humanoid life form engaged in this activity.

Once again, this ain't no pitty party. I am just calling attention to an observation. It may be that the book "Way of the Rifle" should be the second book on rifle shooting, after a book or some guidance on weight loss. Because there ain't no fat 10 m rifle shooters in the book.

Respectfully,
Bubba
Never been described as svelt.

Dan: I, too, am over 50 (well over!!) and continue to shoot NRA, USAS, ISSF 3 & 4 pos., plus air rifle all year round. I am not winning much any longer, but I am still competitive and have fun at it. As for your elbow reaching your hip-that is not really necessary. What works pretty well is to put the rifle into your shoulder where it fits comfortably and aligns correctly. Then, drop your left arm down to your ribs where it falls naturally. You can make small adjustments to the arm, and support hand, etc. to get the rifle on target and to find your NPA, but this method should work. I know several older fat men who do this and it works just fine. They shoot some great standing scores. I have not shot bench, so I can't comment on that area. But, if I had to stop my position and standing shooting, I am not sure I would move to bench. I probably would just get out of active shooting all together and go more into coaching.
Anyway, that is just my 2 cents worth. If you need any more ideas or help, contact me at: bawilli@attglobal.net and we can talk further.
Don in Oregon

A most inspirational post!

Back in '75 I graduated from High School and was swimming 10,000 yards+ per day. I weighed 168.

Went to the Air Force Academy and during the 6 weeks of the doolie summer where the run most folks a__es off, I gained 30 lbs. At first they thought the scales were bad!

After getting back into the pool I was only able to ever get back down to 180.

Now that I'm old, and after much time sitting in front of a workstation, I too am too fat (230).

Now that I can't have a personal pitty party, I'll get out the door earlier in the AM and see if I can't get that arm in tighter as well!

Joel M

Joel,
I graduated from High School in 1965. So, I am about 10 years your senior. I went to high school on the 4 year plan, instead of the optional 5 year plan, but just barely. So, I am 57 years old.

I used to see a weight gain in the winter, followed by a leight loss in the spring and summer. It was as predictable as the seasons, and the range was about 10 pounds. Then the ratio of weight gain to weight loss changed to favor weight gain and retention, with less loss. This is, from my experience and that of others my age, the natural order of things.

Do you remember when you had to get up from your chair or couch to turn the station on the TV? I can remember it. I can also remember when the internet was a total mystery to me. I have always sought knowledge. sometimes focused on one thing and other times a rather eclectic search for little known ot obscure subject matter. The internet is the devil, when you are seeking fitness.

I hope to see your scores soon on the High Noon Competition. Just do it.

I am getting in some miles walking and, with a cold spell comming up, I'll get some exercise carrying wood to the fire place. The woman needs a fire, she says, and it is good exercise for me. The dog, Lucy the terrible Jack Russel Terrier demands a walk each evening and we both need the esercise.

My wife is helping by only stocking the pantry and frige with healthy stuff. Based on suggested diets it seems like celery, carrots and nuts, in moderation are the only safe foods for me to eat. But there are other healthful alternatives. The region of the country where i live is noted for Fried being the first word in the description of any food on a restaurant's menu. This is changing. Heck you can now even get sushei, raw fish and critters from the sea, in southwest Missouri. Them oriental resraunters are laughing all the way to the bank. Then there are them Vegans. I think that they may be from some star or plannet or system called Vega. And Tofu. Cant abide tht stuff. There are soy beans grown as a cash crop in Missouri, and I have eaten them right off the plants, when accompanied by farmers, to point out what a ripe one looked like. Reckon I'd rather eat them this way than in tofu.

I think moderation and portion control, accompanied by exercise is the answere. Joining one of the cults like Vegans or Atkins diet deciples is the wrong approach. Although I can get more smoked meat, which I dearly love, by incorporating the Atkins concepts that I agree with.

I know that loosing weight will make me a better shooter, at my age and considering the accompanying ailments. So, lets rock.

Shoot the High Noon REQ 30 and report your score as instructed on the site. You can change the score if you shoot a better one, up to the time limit on the monthly match.

I offer this advise, as I know that the next 10 years will be more critical than you can imagine. Been there done that. You got the right tude, so go for it.

I remain,

Respectfully,
Dan Hankins AKA Bubba

Where in SW Missouri are you located? My Wife's family is from the SW City, Neosho,Joplin corner area.

My email is jhm3rd@omartin.com

If a short fat man with no neck can be shooter of the century there is hope for us all... ;-)
Get bone support from your upper arm on your rib cage (for now) and have fun!

Ok,
I am shooting wothout jacket and pants, glove or boots. Wear a t-shirt and sweat pants or shorts, depending on season. Shoes are deck shoes, with or without socks, depending on season. Shoot mainly indoors, with target at proper distance and height. Light on target is fine and light at shooting station is maybe a little bright, but not a problem.

I have no Olympic expetations. I just want to be better than I am.

Begin humor here:
I keep thinking about hook and loop tape, (Velcro (TM). I could use super glue to glue one side of the hook and loop to my rib cage, and the other to the back of the arm that holds the fore arm of the rifle. Cut a small hole in the T-shirt to allow the arm to make contact with the hook and loop. This would assure a consistanc position, and lend some support to the fore arm.

See there are other folks that want to shoot 10 m rifle and the REQ 30 is just perfect for the guys that will never be big time olympic contenders, for many and varied reasons.

I am fully aware that the shooting specific clothing is as essential for top performance as the choice of pellet or rifle. Just part of the kit if you want to go past a certain point.

I am not alone in this thinking. There are shooters that will shoot with you at your home or theirs. There are quite a number of them/us. I am trying my best to get more participation in the near naked class for old guys and beginners. I am tired of hearing how accurate an older/collectors rifle is, only to find out that it's accuracy and all groups shot with it were from a bench. I use the bench to do initial sight in when I change or alter sights, or test pellets for consistancy of feel. You can feel the difference in the firing nature of some of these older 10 m rifles, eapecially spring piston rifles, with different pellets.

Hoping that I can experience the Cheese Burger in Paradise one day, I remain,

Respectfully,
Bubba

Credit to Jimmy Buffet for Song Cheese Burger in Paradise. wherein there is the lyric "loosin weight without speed, eatin sunflower seeds".

Dan: I started off shooting in only my street clothes too. I have found the best way to loose weight and build muscles is to buy all the clothing, a smallbore rifle too, spotting scope, etc. In just getting all my crap (that is equipment- sorry) and my daughter's too to the range I find I have done the equivalent of a 10k running race.

I think most old rifle shooters become pistol shooters.

I'm older than most of you guys. (Past 60) and while I exercise about one to two hours a day and shoot both rifle and pistol I am still fat and old. I simply limit my rifle shooting to standing, no position shooting for me!

I have a friend who is older than I by a few years but still helped set a new National Smallbore Team record at Camp Perry last year so age is no excuse.

Doug in Virginia

I, too, am now approaching old (at least, I feel very old). I used to be a workout junkie, a competetive bike racer and runner, league basketball player, boxer, etc. Used to ride 50+ miles a day in the mountains around Los Angeles and lift weights for a couple of hours, and weighed about 160. I was always a good shot, and was a national level shooter with a compound bow. No more. I recently got the bug to shoot .22 silhouette, and can't make the dot sit even close to still! Just realized why: besides being on the verge of fat now, my resting pulse rate, which once was 55, is now about 88. Pulse rate, think pulse rate.

Dan,
Meet Harod Stenvaag. Olympic silver medal in 1992 in prone 50m rifle and olympic bronze in 2000 in 3-position.



And definitely not some 18-year-old kid! :-)

(But yeah, it does seem you need to get rid of the spare tyre :( Lots of us know what you mean there, I suspect :) )

I'm always fighting my weight, not much luck. Till I was 45 I could eat anything and not gain weight. But now I'm 63 and a tad over 200 pounds at 5 ft 11 in. I still shoot smallbore 3p and benchrest. I shoot indoor 3p leagues in the winter and some outdoor 3p in the summer along with ARA rimflre benchrest. Not sure which tires me out most as I suspect the concentration of shooting is as tiring as the physical aspect of 3p. My eyes give this old body the most trouble. But benchrest requires a scope and the 3p leagues I shoot in allow scope for those above junior.

Mr. Hankins I hear where you're comming from . I'm 54 and about 210 . I have given in to the forces of darkness in that I now use a jacket , and I'm ashamed to admit it a glove . I think I will eventually compromise , and go with a vest - not much support and a place to positivley orient the buttplate . If/when I shoot prone I may contrive to fabricate somekind of elbow pad out of an old jacket sleve . I'm resisting going with the trousers , I dont want to walk around looking like a kid who just peed his snow suit .

I can still remember back in the 70's in England when the" jackets " , could actually be worn into the pub for a self congratulatory post match beer !

Chris

VAshooter wrote:I think most old rifle shooters become pistol shooters.
...Doug in Virginia

Hi Doug

I resemble that remark in a way. I started out wanting to shoot highpower, the closest range that has a 600 yard range isn't too worthwhile. The 600 yard range shoots across the Trap range, Skeet Range, and smallbore parking lot. I tried Shotgun, but decided that carting 500 rounds of 12 gauge around was too much trouble and picked up Bullseye. The only reason you're wearing clothing at all, is to have somewhere to put your off hand. Guns are smaller, and no matter what, you only shoot 270 shots.

Mike

jhmartin
Location: Valencia County 4-H, NM USA

I presume we will see you at the NM Sr Olympics Summer Games in Albuquerque sometime in Aug? I shoot bench rest and standing air pistol in the 65 to 69 age group. I'll also shoot 10 meter air rifle next year when I complete construction of my rifle.
I'm down south in Dona Ana County.

Hey CharlesC,
I have just started shooting smallbore 3p with my daughter who is in 4-H. I am very close to you in Radium. There does not seem to be many position shooters in Southern NM that I have been able to find. email me and maybe we can visit! blkrange@yahoo.com

Thanks,
Scott

Sparks wrote:Dan,
Meet Harod Stenvaag. Olympic silver medal in 1992 in prone 50m rifle and olympic bronze in 2000 in 3-position.



And definitely not some 18-year-old kid! :-)

(But yeah, it does seem you need to get rid of the spare tyre :( Lots of us know what you mean there, I suspect :) )

Naahh!
His name is HARALD, not Harod. (May God forbid).