Automatic discharge claimed in 10M

If you wish to make a donation to this forum's operation , it would be greatly appreciated.
https://www.paypal.com/paypalme/targettalk?yours=true

Moderators: pilkguns, m1963, David Levene, Spencer, Richard H

Forum rules
If you wish to make a donation to this forum's operation , it would be greatly appreciated.
https://www.paypal.com/paypalme/targettalk?yours=true
Post Reply
ausdiver99
Posts: 94
Joined: Sun Sep 05, 2004 1:39 am
Location: Singapore

Automatic discharge claimed in 10M

Post by ausdiver99 »

One for the rule book jockeys.

Midway through a 10 metre club event an athlete claimed the air rifle fired when she closed the cocking lever. The shot hit the target outside the scoring rings and was registered on the EST. The RO asked the athlete to check if the problem could be replicated. The firearm operated normally for the second shot which scored 9.9.

The coach claimed the firearm had malfunctioned and the uncommanded shot should be treated as an allowable malfunction.

Thoughts on options here? Some are:

Shot stands, score 0, the athlete may have roughly closed the lever or touched the trigger since it operated normally on the next shot (and all subsequent shots)

Allowable malfunction as the athlete claimed immediately that shot was uncommanded and allow the athlete to continue since it wasn’t possible to replace the rifle, annul the 0.

Ask the athlete to withdraw/DSQ if the rifle could not be replaced since there was a potential safety issue

Would your answer differ if the shot could not be located?
merlin32
Posts: 21
Joined: Wed Nov 01, 2023 10:44 pm
Location: Melbourne, Australia

Re: Automatic discharge claimed in 10M

Post by merlin32 »

I don't believe an uncommanded discharge is an allowable malfunction in 10m qualifying.



6.13.2.1 Allowable Malfunctions are:
a) A cartridge fails to fire;
b) A bullet or pellet is lodged in the barrel; or
c) The gun fails to fire or function properly and the trigger mechanism has been released.


So, shot is scored as 0 - non-allowable. If it didn't hit the target, technically same thing - scored as 0, but in reality, if no one noticed, just load another pellet and carry on :D
David M
Posts: 1679
Joined: Wed Mar 24, 2004 6:43 pm

Re: Automatic discharge claimed in 10M

Post by David M »

If the firearm had a uncommanded discharge then it needs to be removed from the line to be fixed as it is should be considered unsafe.
Claim a break and cease to function and have it fixed off line.
If the pellet left the barrel then it is considered a scored shot.
The RO should not have allowed the next shot and had it removed the firearm from the line.
User avatar
Azmodan
Posts: 429
Joined: Tue Feb 19, 2019 4:00 pm
Location: Romania

Re: Automatic discharge claimed in 10M

Post by Azmodan »

it happened to me too (pistol). the gun shot when i closed the bolt while on the table.
it was not even registered on the EST.

the RO put a 0 for that shot. was not allowed to reshoot it
Airpistol: Feinwerkbau P8X
STP: Pardini SP
CFP: Pardini HP
Freepistol: TOZ-35
PPC: CZ Shadow 2
PCC: Nova Modul CTS9
BR50: CZ 457 LRP
Gwhite
Posts: 3434
Joined: Sat Sep 04, 2004 6:04 pm
Location: Massachusetts

Re: Automatic discharge claimed in 10M

Post by Gwhite »

The college team I help coach has an entire museum of older air guns. Sears DO wear, and we occasionally get pistols that will discharge when the action is closed. Sometimes it can be aggravated by the shooter not being assertive enough when cocking, but basically, the gun needs to be taken out of service and (most likely) the sear adjusted.

Fortunately, I don't recall it ever happening to us in in a match. I think I've had to repair 3 pistols in 15 years. They were mostly Benelli Kites, but we have a lot of them.

We used to have it happen occasionally with free pistols, especially Hammerli 160's, which is much more exciting. The students wouldn't cock them fully. It's been a while since we shot free pistol, but my recollection is that there's no adjustment for the sear engagement.
User avatar
rmca
Posts: 1204
Joined: Sun Nov 04, 2012 3:55 pm
Location: Lisbon, Portugal

Re: Automatic discharge claimed in 10M

Post by rmca »

This is a hard one to call if it was really a malfunction, unless the referee is looking directly at the shooter in question.
99,9999% of the time, an unwanted discharge is caused by the shooter, so the referee acted accordingly.
In my view the call was correct. Shot stands as a 0, and there is no re shoot (that I guess was the referee giving the benefit of doubt to the shooter).
If it happens again, then the gun should be removed and repaired as it is not safe, and its an allowable (and confirmed) malfunction.
But since subsequent shoots were normal, it's not an allowable malfunction.

In this case, the probable causes are:
- Shooter was careless cocking/closing the breach,
- Trigger/sear too light (plus the 1st reason),
- Shooter conscious or not pull the trigger,
- Shooter put a zero on the target by pulling the trigger too soon, and is trying to get away with it (most likely unfortunately...).

Hope this helps
Post Reply