TargetTalk

Not a lawyer, but if I interpret the bill correctly, a lot of European Target Pistols will now become illegal to import and then ultimately transfer or sell in the US.

Because of the language written to try and best identify AR style pistols, many common sport and standard pistols will now be illegal.

Here's the text that now defines the new semi-automatic assault pistol ....

(D) A semiautomatic pistol that—

(i) has an ammunition feeding device that is not a fixed ammunition feeding device; and

(ii) has any 1 of the following:

(I) A threaded barrel.

(II) A second pistol grip.

(III) A barrel shroud.

(IV) The capacity to accept a detachable ammunition feeding device at some location outside of the pistol grip.

(V) A semiautomatic version of an automatic firearm.

(VI) A manufactured weight of 50 ounces or more when unloaded.

(VII) A buffer tube, stabilizing brace or similar component that protrudes horizontally behind the pistol grip.

If it has a removable magazine and that magazine is not in the grip, you have a semiautomatic assault pistol. Also, quite a few modern designs have what meets their definition of a barrel shroud.

Not a complete list, but I think this would apply to all of the following:

Benelli MP 90 and 95 Series
Hammerli 280
Hammerli SP-20
Match Guns MG2/MG4
Morini CM22 and CM32 Series
Pardini HP Series
Pardini MP Series
Pardini SP/SPE Series
Sako TriAce
Walther GSP series
Walther OSP series
Walther GSP 500

Some of the FAS and Unique firearms might also be at risk because of the barrel shroud rule.

They do have a section for excluded firearms, but it does not list any semi-automatic target pistols.

Definition V appears to exclude all the sport pistols I know of, as does VII.
Definition VI excludes all ISSF match-legal sport pistols which can weigh no more than 49.4± oz.

It appears that the law was much more narrowly drafted than the 1994 law with respect to our pistols.

This is exactly what happened in NY when they created the safe act and deemed any pistol with a mag forward of the grip and assault weapon.

william wrote: ↑Sat Jul 30, 2022 4:04 pm Definition V appears to exclude all the sport pistols I know of, as does VII.
Definition VI excludes all ISSF match-legal sport pistols which can weigh no more than 49.4± oz.

It appears that the law was much more narrowly drafted than the 1994 law with respect to our pistols.

You're reading that wrong. I-VII aren't exclusions; they are features that, if any are present, mean the gun is an assault weapon.

D(i) (semi-auto with a removable magazine) + any *single* feature listed in I thru VII = assault weapon.

In other words, many ISSF pistols, including most of the popular ones, would be illegal.

Most states have an Olympic exemption lists for pistols. It has just about everything, including those that are exempted anyway in the first place such as free pistols. (for example. I used to have a East German Buhag, still kicking myself for selling it) I am surprised that the electronic trigger Green is also listed. But of course not everything is in the list. For example if you have a MatchGuns MG3, then it is not on the list. But then I have no idea how many MatchGuns MG3 (Rapid Fire using .22 short) were made in the first place..
Here is the California list. Please check your own state, IIRC the MA list is the same.

https://oag.ca.gov/sites/all/files/agwe ... rms/op.pdf

conradin wrote: ↑Wed Aug 03, 2022 7:25 am Most states have an Olympic exemption lists for pistols. It has just about everything, including those that are exempted anyway in the first place such as free pistols. (for example. I used to have a East German Buhag, still kicking myself for selling it) I am surprised that the electronic trigger Green is also listed. But of course not everything is in the list. For example if you have a MatchGuns MG3, then it is not on the list. But then I have no idea how many MatchGuns MG3 (Rapid Fire using .22 short) were made in the first place..
Here is the California list. Please check your own state, IIRC the MA list is the same.

https://oag.ca.gov/sites/all/files/agwe ... rms/op.pdf

State laws would not trump federal law and allow the exemption

OK, I read 1808. The problem seems to be the list made is out of date. For example, for rifle, it only has FWB2600 as exempt. There is no mention of 2700 and 2800. I used to own 2700, and 2700 is considered old already! The pistols list is better since they are merely a list of rimfire version of "assault rifles"...ie, AR-15 pistols. "Better" means it sucks less.
I don't see any competition pistols listed, should I assume that in that case, the state exemption list is now valid since there is no specific federal list to trump it?

I wonder who is the one who decides which target firearm should be listed as exempt which is not. I thought rhode island is one of the east coast states that are more firearm friendly. I guess I am wrong..

Gosh! I can’t believe we are in this pickle. How could this have come about??

It amazes me when some gun owners who fall for the “sensible gun law” horse manure are surprised when their favorite gun becomes a target; priceless!
This week 947 civilians and service members fired the Presidents Rifle Match (P100) at Camp Perry and 749 shot in the National Trophy Individual Match, all but a very few using AR-15s. Been happening every year there since 1907 with whatever the latest iteration of government issued rifle looks like. The week before, 75 of us shot the 2022 National Smallbore Championships there.
We can have a discussion of firearm types in common “sporting use” today.
The number of good folks coming to Camp Perry every year from places like New York, California, and other states with draconian gun laws is diminishing. It’s becoming difficult for them because some legislators find it easier to punish law-abiding citizens and let outlaws heat up the wheel bearings on the revolving door of justice. We will all be in the same boat shortly lest we protect the Constitution.

Amen to that rgibson.
Not only belonging to a 2nd Amendment group like the NRA, you should call your state and federal politicians (whether republican or democrat) and let them know your wants and opinions. They don't know what to do, unless you specifically clue them in, sometimes just one voice can educate them.
Stan

Our club has bi-weekly weekend 200 yards matches. I would say 2/3 of the competitors use AR-15. With all the blinks too. The remaining ones using typical semi-automatic rifle, and then a very few use space guns (ie, ISSF type 300M) or older target-service rifles like the K31. One of them, a long time member, who is our club's champion, told us that he would never surrender his AR-15, and he will continue to use it in the club. This is despite people told him he should not say things like that, it can get him in trouble, which means it can get us in trouble. I do feel for him, he is not just a great shooter, but he put in so many blinks on his AR-15 that it will be painful to take it away from him. (He is also a veteran). We are not cowards, but we certainly do not need to put a sign in the front gate that says AR-15 matches!! All we will do is not speak about it, not "see" about it...(you know the drill). Just don't create *any* publicity. Shooting competition is a very personal thing.

I would not say you are cowards but that kind of thinking is why we are where we are today. The anti-gun crowd has convinced the non-gun owning public that the vast majority of AR-15s are used by evil people to kill other people when the opposite is true. There are 20 million plus ARs out there. FBI crime statistics don’t bear out the claim that ARs are only used for criminal purposes. I respectfully submit that your club’s approach is not helping and will only result in the continuing incremental destruction of the Constitution. That being said, you should consider advertising “Highpower” matches. Those interested will know what you mean, especially if you put out a Match Program containing rule numbers for rifles allowed. The general public is probably not going to go into the weeds reading the program and then the rulebook.

I dread the day when at a Hi Power match or any HP rifle/pistol competition (any state) and the ATF, State Police and local LEOs show up to "inspect, confiscate and arrest" persons in possession of said forth "assault weapons", high capacity magazines etc. Shooting competitions might have to go underground and only advertise by word of mouth. Even though some of the competitors are probably LE too. Going to make for a VERY interesting and VERY VERY sad day.

*whom* should we call? Senators? Congressman? The RI guy who wrote 1808?
I think we should let them know and make it clear that if the Ban occurs, not just the entire USA Olympic team will be in jail, but anyone who compete in target shooting competition. We also should let them know that the list they have is completely out of date, the exemption list has Olympic guns that were made in the 80s and 90s, while at least two generations of upgrade is not listed. We need to drill it in their heads that there is a Olympic exemption list in a lot, if not vast majority, of states. The list is compiled by Team USA so they are the one to know which ones are for competition, which ones are not. The list is pretty extensive. Simply copy that list to the 1808 and it will do.
We can take some modification for AR-15 such as few capacity magazine. For example, drums. I cannot think of a reason why anyone use a drum magazine other than having fun. I shot a machine gun before, it is fun. But it is an expensive hobby. $400 all gone after 30 seconds worth of shots.
Of curse, constitutionally, we have the full right to own an AR-15 with a drum.