TargetTalk

I'm still on the hunt for my first pistol. I think I've decided to just spend what it takes to get a good gun from the start. I'm currently looking at importing a pistol from Krale. First I was looking at the Steyr LP2 but also saw the Match Guns MGH1, the newish gun from Cesare Morini.

What's the feedback on the mechanical trigger model. I saw they are in the middle of implementing a small fix by adding another screw to the trigger mechanism.

What do you guys think, it seems like a good value and comes with 2 cylinders unlike 1 on the LP2. Is it too early to jump on one with me being new to air pistols.

Of course my other option is to really suck it up and go with a Steyr LP10, did I mention that would be WAY over my original budget though lol.

Bite the pellet just once and go for the steyr LP10.
Even if that means saving for a little longer.
You'll never look back afterwards...

Watch this videos if you are uncertain about the LP10
http://www.steyr-sport.com/index.php/en ... ice-movies

Hope this helps

Another thing I'm curious about it whether or not people recommend the full size Steyr LP10 or the Compact version. I would never have thought of going with the compact but apparently Pilkguns feels so strongly that people should get the Compact that they'll refuse to sell you a full sized gun unless you can provide proof of a high match score.

One think I like about the full size model is the extra weight, it would more closely resemble the weight of my S&W 41 and Les Baer 1911.

Be aware that with Matchguns, you have no service support in the States (I'm assuming you are in the States).

I had a GP-1 (Gehman branded MG-1) that developed a regulator issue after about 2000 rounds. Stephano at Matchguns in Italy was fairly sure of the diagnosis of the problem but had no parts to send and no US service center to work on it if he did. The only option was to send it to Italy and do the back and forth customs/shipping thing. I was told it would probably take 9 months to a year before I saw the pistol again.

I really liked the pistol. Great grip, nice balance and fantastic trigger. I was truly disappointed. I ended up with a Morini 162EI and haven't looked back.

As far as a 'long' vs 'compact' and the weight of the 'long' being a closer match to the weight of your 1911 and mdl 41, I think you would find that the different grip angle and nose heavy balance of a 'long' would negate any weight matching advantage. A 'compact' with weight added close to the center would probably work better for that.

Well that's pretty crappy, first off they should have parts available to send you to be fixed yourself or by a gunsmith at your cost. Secondly 9-12 months turnaround is ridiculous when the round trip via UPS to Italy should only take 2 weeks max. That's probably enough to turn me away from them, I want to do some serious practice and would be totally miffed to lose the gun for a year.

I've still not totally given up on the FAS6004 however they're near impossible to get currently. Airguns of Arizona says they've had them on back order since before Christmas but thinks he's about to get a shipment in. I'm trying to get them to find out if they'll have any left after they fill all back orders. Otherwise who knows when the next shipment will be.

The fact Pilk refuses to sell the long version of the LP10 to anyone unable to show proof of a 555 or higher in competition speaks volumes since its probably cost him a few sales. Being relatively new to pistols and absolutely green with air pistols I'd probably benefit more from the compact.

Maybe you can negotiate with Pilkguns & buy the long version with a short cylinder. That will move the weight back quite a bit, but you'll still get the longer sight radius. You can also go to the long cylinder whenever you want.

I just double checked, and they will upgrade your pistols to a long version if you shoot better than a 555 at a "major" competition within 2 years. You can get a FREE long version if you can do it in 1 year.

I suspect they are doing this because they've had a lot of unhappy customers. If you are used to shooting with almost anything but a free pistol, the longer sight radius will make it LOOK like it's wobbling more. That can freak out some shooters.

I wonder what Pilkguns opinion of the Morini short is,as the sight base is the same as the long version,I expect they refuse to sell them at all!

tufty wrote:I wonder what Pilkguns opinion of the Morini short is,as the sight base is the same as the long version,I expect they refuse to sell them at all!

I pondered on that one myself.

Anyway, the original poster should just go and buy a full size LP10. May be over budget, but does it matter, it's not exactly a lot of money is it? It's a great starter pistol, as you can just stick with it all your shooting life. Then when you give up, I bet you wouldn't have lost much money when you want to sell it.
If Pilkguns won't sell you one without begging. Get it from someone else. Or better still, find a mint used one for around $500 less.

It's great to start with a pistol that you have no excuses or doubts.
I see a lot of people start the sport with some old cheap pistol, only to progress, then need to sell it to buy something better.

I restarted the sport 2 years ago with a new LP10. Probably had every top air pistol sinse then except Matchgun hybrid, found there is no magic gun. They all shoot better than the shooter.

Walther LP400 carbon is the prettiest.
Feinwerkbau P44 is about the highest in the hnd and most adjustable.
Pardini K12 is the longest.
Morini 162ei has the best trigger and cost the most to convert to Left hand shooting.
Steyr LP5/50 is the most versatile with 5 shot and single shot mags.
SAM about the most unpopular but really underrated.
Steyr LP10e most likely to go wrong!

nick marshall wrote: LP10... a great starter pistol, as you can just stick with it all your shooting life.

I restarted the sport 2 years ago with a new LP10. Probably had every top air pistol sinse then

Should your advice be taken as a wise experience accumulated after a lot of futile attempts to go against it?

shaky hands wrote:

nick marshall wrote: LP10... a great starter pistol, as you can just stick with it all your shooting life.

I restarted the sport 2 years ago with a new LP10. Probably had every top air pistol sinse then

Should your advice be taken as a wise experience accumulated after a lot of futile attempts to go against it?

Possibly.
But I have enjoyed owning and shooting all these different air pistols. So I woudnt expect people to just stick wth the one pistol.

All I would say is buy the best you can't afford.

We are lucky with air pistols. We can shoot the same pistol as the world champion without breaking the bank.

There's a time when the shooter stops adapting the pistol to himself, and starts adapting himself to the pistol! I guess thas the first day of our new life...

nick marshall wrote:We are lucky with air pistols. We can shoot the same pistol as the world champion without breaking the bank.

I wouldn't say that air pistols are special in this regard. Surely, horse riding, competitive sailing, and bike racing might be different, but swimming, soccer, running, tennis, gymnastics, skating, hockey, and the rest of the vast majority of Olympic sports are not that different from shooting.

shaky hands wrote:

nick marshall wrote:We are lucky with air pistols. We can shoot the same pistol as the world champion without breaking the bank.

I wouldn't say that air pistols are special in this regard. Surely, horse riding, competitive sailing, and bike racing might be different, but swimming, soccer, running, tennis, gymnastics, skating, hockey, and the rest of the vast majority of Olympic sports are not that different from shooting.

Where did Nick Marshall say air pistols were "special in this regard". He just said we were lucky???

In case you are serious, I was basing my comment on the presumption that "luck" must refer to something less ordinary than normal.

zanemoseley wrote:What's the feedback on the mechanical trigger model. I saw they are in the middle of implementing a small fix by adding another screw to the trigger mechanism.

I haven't seen a bad Steyr yet - they only make Air Pistols and they do quite a nice job of it.

Played with an LP-2 in the weekend. Nice trigger, and a great price-point.

I shot a MGH1 Hybrid and it was nice too, but intermittently unreliable. No good. Maybe it was just a bad example - it was quite early on in the production.

I genuinely feel bad for throwing a manufacturer under the bus, but I find it hard to recommend them.

TL;DR - Steyr is an easy choice - good value and top tier construction with proven design. Matchguns if you like 'beta-testing'!



Addendum: On a subject of pricing.

This is all very much cheaper than yacht racing, used to crew (Grinder/Ballast) on a Young 88 during my time at University. Old joke: do you know what B.O.A.T stands for?
Bust out another thousand.

Zanemosley,
Just to confuse you a bit more....

I totally disagree with SamEEE!
:-)

The difference between Cesare Morini production at Matchguns is that he keeps improving his pistols whereas other companies keep producing faulty expensive toys!
An example?

1) ask all those who have advised you to buy a Steyr about the recoil absorber which continuously blocks , giving you an inconsistent behaviour!
I sold my Steyr LP10E to a very good shooter who regularly shoots 388/400 (whereas I regularly shoot only 366). I asked him and he said that he regularly needs to open the pistol clean and oil the adsorbed to reduce the number of times it blocks!
Don't misunderstand me.... I liked lp10, but this is the true.
Why don't they improve the air regulator? You can shoot 60 shots and then grouping deteriorates!
Why don't they improve the electronic trigger??? Well they are doing that, it is just taking ages.

2) Walther. They are on a constant beta version with the dreadful trigger of lp400! I stopped counting the number of times they changed the trigger at 3... The problem is that they were going back to previous versions, not getting a new one! Is there a better way to admit that there is a problem they cannot solve????
The old lp300 is far better.

The same applies to other producers, this is just an example.

I have never had problems with Matchguns MGH1 and since Cesare has added the additional screw on the cocking block the trigger has become even better. An Olympic shooter at my club who liked it but rated second after Morini 162ei, after this change likes it more than that pistol.
An old shooter at one of my clubs, who shoots with hand support, regularly shoots 98/100....is that inconsistent?

So if you don't need an absorber buy either the Morini Competition 162ei which is great and reliable after 30years of consisten quality or Matchguns MGH1 for cutting edge evolution.
If you want an adsorber buy Pardini k12.

No other alternative to Italian (and Italian Swiss) technology.

Thanks, Rider. I am yet to buy my first air pistol (doing the bulk of my shooting with free pistol and then training with SCATT), but I would like to take a plunge, cough up the money, and get one soon. What I have heard about Steyr is putting me off. This is probably a great gun for champions who have swarms of gunsmiths taking care of their pistols, but not for a layman like me. MatchGuns is too new and some people questioned its reliability and then the availability of parts here in US. I am down to the choice between Pardini K12 and Morini 162E. I like the recoil absorber on K12, but I would like to be able to dryfire multiple shots without having to lower the arm, as part of my hold exercises. Apparently electronic triggers allow that.

"I would like to be able to dryfire multiple shots without having to lower the arm"

I understand that opinion. Wouldn't it be more useful to replicate - minus the pellet - a live shot? When I was seeing my brainwasher (he gave me a discount because of the undersize load), he had me visualize the entire shot process even to bringing the pistol down after the shot.

I agree with William. I bought electronic for that same reason. However for a short while I tried cocking every time with my MGH1 electronic trigger, pistol set on dry, and does not annoy at all repeating the whole process....may be it is actually better for muscle and brain memory. So I would not decide any more on mechanical versus electronic based on dry firing.