TargetTalk

Hello Gents
I have a projeckt going, to make a .32 Smith mod 16 into a "racegun" in the snubnoseclass(we have competitions for snubnoserevolvers) Two major things have been done, the orginal barrel is replaced with a .308 riflebarrel and the cylinder is shortend to take just .32 s&w long cartridge. The cylinder has also ball bearings. But what bulletdiameter and what kind of bullet do you think would work best? To start with I will try .313wc and swc, but I see Lee have a mold who drops bullets at .311 dia.

The revolver is still at the gunsmith, havent tryed it yet

The most important thing is probably what shape the front of the bullet is so it will be easy to reload in the cylinder unless speed isn't necessary. Guns normally won't shoot accurately with a bullet much above barrel groove diameter unless the alloy used is relatively soft. (Less than 10BHN). I would find out first, how small of a bullet can go into the S&W long without slipping in the case as it will depend on what size the brass is after sizing with your dies. I know a .312 will generally still fit tightly enough and you may be able to go to .311.

A lot of people shot Benellis or Pardinis with .308 barrels because the .314 barrels they came with were too large and a good .308 barrel was easy to come up with. All of the people that I knew that did this shot HBWC's which were quite soft and had good results. Go as close to .308 as you can without it sliding in the case when reloading. That .311 bullet will easily size small enough.

Thx for the advise oldcaster. I have 3 bulletmolds in .32, a Lee tlswc 90 gr, a Hensley&Gibbs 98gr swc and a RCBS 90gr wc. I hope I can get some good results with the Hensley&gibbs mold, it`s a 4 cavity mold. But will buy the Lee mold(6cav)to. Have also ordered some teflonbased powdercoat, I have never powdercoated bullets before, so I am looking forward to try it. I will post the results here

I would be interested in your results from powder coated bullets. I have never tried them either and don't know anyone who has.

I would suggest a discussion with the gunsmith. If this was a Model 16-4 (.32 H&R Mag) and the original cylinder (which it looks like but its a picture), then you might want to check and see how much and how large the cylinder throat is.

Cylinder throats and barrel throats + alignment will generally determine the available accuracy of the average revolver. I suspect you are going to need bullets on the large size (.313) to get good accuracy. But then again, I'm just a pistol shooter, not a gunsmith.

If it was the later version of the Model 16 (full lugged .32 H&R mag), I'm impressed. Not many people would turn a $1000 to $1500 revolver into a custom snubbie. Most people generally use the Model 30 or 31 for this type of conversion. I have even heard of some trying to chamber the older ones for the new .327 Federal!

CR10X wrote:
If it was the later version of the Model 16 (full lugged .32 H&R mag), I'm impressed. Not many people would turn a $1000 to $1500 revolver into a custom snubbie. Most people generally use the Model 30 or 31 for this type of conversion. I have even heard of some trying to chamber the older ones for the new .327 Federal!

It was a full lugged mod 16 .32mag. But I have two of them.. This one had allready ball bearings in the cylinder and the hammer was bobbed, so there was very little collectorvalue left. I saw one for sale just a couple of days ago, seller asked 2900 dollar for it.. The first one I payed 150 dollar for, the second one I had to pay around 1000 dollar. But this is in Norway(europe), I think it was imported just 500 of this model back in the 90`s, so they are quite rare.

Thanks for the information. The fact that any Model 16s went to Norway is surprising and I did not know that.. The gun is an impressive project. Good luck.

CR10X wrote:I would suggest a discussion with the gunsmith. If this was a Model 16-4 (.32 H&R Mag) and the original cylinder (which it looks like but its a picture), then you might want to check and see how much and how large the cylinder throat is.

It looks to me as if there is likely to be no cylinder throat left at all, given how much has been cut off the cylinder.

JamesH wrote:

CR10X wrote:I would suggest a discussion with the gunsmith. If this was a Model 16-4 (.32 H&R Mag) and the original cylinder (which it looks like but its a picture), then you might want to check and see how much and how large the cylinder throat is.

It looks to me as if there is likely to be no cylinder throat left at all, given how much has been cut off the cylinder.

The cylinder is cut to give a max OAL 33mm(1,298") The cylinderthroats are very long, so when I compare to my other M16 , there should be about 3mm(0.118") throat left. And I can still use 32mag brass if I want to.(but no magnumloads)
(edit: just spoke with my gunsmith, he said 3,5mm or 0.137")

I have done a large number of the short cylinders, and also bushed the cylinder with bronze in .38s.. 38 allows very little area to install the bushings, let alone a bearing system.. The 32 may have more room, I don't know. At any rate, I would like to see a picture of the ball bearing system.. The big advantage to the bronze bushings, is to maximize support and minimize tolerance. It's very effective, and tightens the group.....The yoke provides but a small machined area to provide support the bushing/bearing.. I suppose the yoke tube could be replaced with a machined shaft.. Have not done that, but have contemplated it..

Jerry, I will take some pictures of the ball bearing system when I get my revolver back. The downside with the ball bearing system is that the extractor push the brass only 4-5mm out from the cylinder, so you basically have to pick out the empty brass one by one. And the extractor are springloaded so if the brass sticks hard to the chamberwalls it becomes a problem. But to be honest, ball bearings adds very little to a good DA pull.
My English is also a problem, I struggle a little bit with tecnical terms.

oldcaster wrote:I would be interested in your results from powder coated bullets. I have never tried them either and don't know anyone who has.

Got my powdercoat yesterday and had to test. I am pleased with the result, this is just a testrun with very few bullets. The coating seem`s to stick on very well, and it`s slick and hard. This was a powdercot with teflon, and I have so far no idea how it works, at work this weekend, no time to shoot.

oldcaster wrote:I would be interested in your results from powder coated bullets. I have never tried them either and don't know anyone who has.

These are very popular in Australia. From the Hawkesbury River Bullet Company's website -

"The next stage in the operation involves bullet coating (lubricating). This is a proprietary step which produces the three dry coating marketed by HRBC. – Blackhawkes, Copperhawkes and Silverhawkes. Coating is a 3-stage process using proprietary phenolic. Hy-Tek resin coating. Each projectile receives three coats of a specified lubricant resin followed by oven curing after each coating pass. The resultant coating is uniform, and while providing the necessary lubricant when fired, it also offers some advantages that may not immediately come to mind. The hard coating provides some positives for occupational health concerns relating to lead. The coating helps to limit lead absorption by contact when handling during reloading, and also helps to minimise the production of lead vapour, particularly on indoor, enclosed firing ranges.

Blackhawkes is the name given to the company’s original signature product using a well proven Supercoat system. These projectiles are the backbone of the HRBC product line.

Copperhawkes use a special Hy-Tek super slippery performance coating containing copper as the name implies, and are designed for higher velocities.

Silverhawkes are coated with a clear coating and are manufactured to fill the needs of those shooting the nostalgic western action matches, where the look of yesteryear is part of the deal, and velocities are moderate."

Gents.
I have now used my mod 16 for a while, and it works great. I get good precicion at 50 yrd, 2,2" I consider good for this little gun. I size my bullets to .314 and there are NO leading in the .308 barrel. I use it with N310, but I have reasently tried Hodgdon Clay in .38 spes with good results, I think this powder should be suitable for a light targetload in .32 s&w long also? I have very little experience with american powder, and I can`t find any reloading data for it. But if I start With 1,4gr clays and a 90gr bullet?

The rule for cast bullets is to slug the barrel to find its diameter, then size
1 1/2 to 2 thou over the slugged size.
ie If the barrel slugs at .311 then size .313
My Hammerli sluggs at .312 1/2 and I use .314
If using hollow based wad cutters then you can use barrel size (with enough
powder load to fill the skirt out) or up to .002 over size for very light loads.