TargetTalk

I use a spotting scope to check my 10m AP score after each shot.

I found that my score for ten shots series are better using one shot-one spotting scope check method. Some how, my ten shot series without spotting scope check is just lower, even if I really take my time in between shots.

I can't explain the difference.

So now I have developed the habit of one shot, one spotting scope check ritual. I do not have the urge to quickly look at the scope after each shot.

Is this spot checking after each shot a poor habit to form? Would I end up not having enough time in actual 60 shots match?

fkw:

Sounds like lack of confidence in yourself.

You should 'go with the flow' and follow through; shoot a solid five shot group and then checkout the results.


Kevho
Airgun aficionado from Costa Rica, C.A.

I do the same; one advantage is that spotting is not a stress factor for me. My reason is mostly technical: I "call the shot" to myself and want to see whether it hit where I thought it should. I'm not obsessed with keeping track of the score, but I'm interested in making sure things work as expected whether godd or bad.

Forgetting to bring your scope if one is not set up at the range may become a stress factor. When shooting at electronic targets this is not an issue, and regular scope users have the advantage of being used to instant feedback.

There is no right or wrong on this.

When I used to shoot the 25m events I would always scope each shot in the precision or 150s stages.

At 10m I will always either look at the monitor or bring the target back to the firing point after each shot.

I consider calling the shot to be an essential part of my routine, and that includes checking that I am calling correctly.

I'm just starting out and I use a scope for every shot...
It's a little adictive but it also gives me some cause and effect information.
The Rika gives me even more information but it is distruptive to my training, where the scope does not seem to be.

I've competed three times, each time without using the scope. It didn't seem to mess me up...

Another aspect of this:

I've always been a little "trigger happy" in all shooting disciplines, and need some slowing down. Spotting between shots helps me do this.

I like to "confirm" my call. If it's not where I said it was it alerts me to poor technique I may not have seen looking at the sights.

Kinda snaps me outta my cheap shit, as my DI used to say.

i was taught the scope was to help you adjust your sights

try adjusting your sights after each shot

i click each way up/down left/right towards the center (unless it needs more)

will shift your group in the right direction

jimmynich wrote:i was taught the scope was to help you adjust your sights
try adjusting your sights after each shot
i click each way up/down left/right towards the center (unless it needs more)
will shift your group in the right direction

I must disagree. There are many more things than just the sights that affect where the hole is on the target.

If the hole is where you called it then why adjust your sights.

One of the techniques for shooting high scores is to reinforce the entire shot "process" that results in a ten. If you don't use your scope after every shot, you won't know which shots were tens. That makes it much more difficult to develop the technique required to shoot tens consistently.

I find it very useful to know when I've fired a ten. I can then concentrate on duplicating the "feel" of that shot for the next one. When things are going well, I can crank out a string of them in a relatively short time without any agonizing.

Alternatively, if I know when I haven't shot a ten, I can develop a sense for what the conditions are that do NOT produce a good shot. In slow fire, I can abort that shot, refocus on shooting a ten, and begin again.

On very rare occasions, I have been so confident of my hold & release that I _know_ it was a ten. Although I have considered not scoping it, I always succumb to curiosity. Besides, that would introduce a variation in my shot process. If every shot is going to be a ten, then minimizing every variation (even after the shot) is a good thing.

Bottom line: scope every shot. Learn from it. Shoot more tens.

Notice: I do not focus on my score, only on what will make the next shot a ten.

jimmynich wrote:i was taught the scope was to help you adjust your sights

try adjusting your sights after each shot

i click each way up/down left/right towards the center (unless it needs more)

will shift your group in the right direction

All this technique will achieve, is to wear out the threads of the sight adjustment screws.

As most of you do, I scope each shot in precision to confirm that my call is correct. My rule for adjusting sights is as follows. If my first shot is on call but not a ten, I review my shot sequence and shoot the second shot. If it is on call in the same quadrant as the first,I seriously consider a sight adjustment to center the group. I again review my sequence and fire the third shot. If it is on call and near the first two I definately make the sight adjustment .Come to think of it,I make the adjustment even if the shot is not on call.and if all are in the ten. Center the group is the rule and that is what I always do. Good Shooting Bill Horton

This is an interesting topic.

I mainly use a scope for 25m/50m to check the sighters, and the first 5-10 shots of a match until I am confident that the pistol is indeed sighted in, and I am also "calling the shots" and checking through the scope. However, once I am confident the pistol is sighted in, I will continue the rest of the standard, Centrefire or 50m match without looking through the scope anymore as I know what I must do with each shot to score a ten, and if it is not a ten then I don't want to know about it during the series!

The same applies for 10m air pistol, you can check the sighters and the first number of shots by scope or other method until you are confident the pistol is sighted in for you, and then it is about repeatedly shooting 10's if you can, and not about checking each shot. The additional scope checking routine could become a distraction, unless there is a useful purpose to it.

An interesting topic indeed.

I guess responses will depend on the level each re-spondee is at.

I don't use a scope at all in AP, you can't do it in major competitions so why do it in training.

My personal opinion is that you may be using the scope as a bit of a safety mechanism. By this I mean that you are consistently looking for a positive reinforcement once you have fired a shot. On the face of it that sounds like a good thing (positive reinforcement will cause the previous thing to happen more.) However when you delve deeper it can be crippling.

The hole in the card is merely an outcome it tells you if you did things correctly or not (to that end it is not an entirely accurate judgement of a shot, I know I have had some pretty fluky 10's.)

If you know that your scope is a crutch for you to use when shooting then you must learn to shoot without it. Reason being is that somewhere, somehow you will not have a scope available for you to use and you will want to be able to shoot without the scope.

If you truly commit to your sight alignment when aiming you will not need to use a scope of confirm your calls because you will know they are right.

Good luck

lastman wrote:I don't use a scope at all in AP, you can't do it in major competitions so why do it in training.

In major competitions you will either see each shot on the monitor or on the target when you bring it back to change.

Even if you are training on returning targets, and shooting more than one shot per target, it is still a good idea to bring the target back to the firing point after each shot. It instills the "big match" rhythm.

lastman wrote:If you know that your scope is a crutch for you to use when shooting then you must learn to shoot without it. Reason being is that somewhere, somehow you will not have a scope available for you to use and you will want to be able to shoot without the scope.

Is that in the same way as you might not have a gun available to you? You take both to the match with you.

clicking to center is an exercise that is taught in "training on the line" to encourage sight changes
a lot of shooters have good groups that don't count for any thing as they
aren't near the 10
1 click towards the 10 tightens the group (most shooters have no idea the
distance 1 click moves the shot)
i change my sights to shoot the timed series in center/sports
thats 15 clicks each way for the match
cant recall how many times the sights
on my toz revolver have clicked in 15 years or my ij35 for that matter

jimmynich wrote:clicking to center is an exercise that is taught in "training on the line" to encourage sight changes

Are you advocating changing the sights after each shot because of where the hole is or because the hole is not where you expected it to be.

An experienced shooter with proven shot calling ability might be justified in adjusting the sights based on a single shot. Without that proven ability however I would suggest that you might want to wait until you see a trend.

Worth mentioning that the use of spotting scopes at ISSF events is not permitted in 10 metre events. See Rule 8.5.1.

when they supply every shooter with the electronic equipment they have
at the olympics and commonwealth events they can have my scope

unless i shoot a 10 dead center i will always click towards the center
by one click for precision
after sighters in centerfire (timed) i need to make decision based on the group that i shoot
look at the back of a target after 60 shots precision(to late to see the trend)
and see where the group is centered shifting the sights moves the center of the group not the size of it
it theory if you can hold a 10 ring you could achieve the maximum score
but i helps if the center of that group is in the middle of the target

jimmynich wrote:shifting the sights moves the center of the group not the size of it

That is correct. What you are suggesting however is that you would alter your sights based on the position of a shot you knew was, for example, snatched away from the centre.

I suspect that most people on this forum would find that strange.