TargetTalk

Hello All,

I was hoping to find some of you out there with a good eye for positions that would not mind taking a few minutes to lookover my position. I have attached photos of as many viewpoints as I can think of. Please give me any questions, comments or suggestions you might have. Overall, it feels quite steady. I have been shooting 199-200s on conventional 50 and 100yd targets for the last few weeks. However, after about 30 shots, my hand starts to go to sleep, and I have a hard time blocking that out and focusing on the shots. I've only been shooting for 4 months, so I would like to sort any issues now before I make any bad habits that might keep me from progressing further. I have tried moving the hand stop and sling in multiple positions, but it only seems to make the situation worse or create new problems. I suppose I could continue as I am doing things now and just take a break every 20 shots or so, but I will be competing in my first usas 50m prone match in a few weeks, and do not want to waste too much of the alloted 75min if it isnt necessary. Thanks for looking.

Brendan

Nice pictures...show your prone positions pretty well. Check out the books "Way fo the Rifle" and "Airgun Shooting". Either one will give you good analytical information relative to position.
One observation....ideally your rifle should generally be in line with your right leg. See page 15 in "Ways". Imagine a line that connects your rifle muzzle, the tip of your right shoulder and the tip of your right heel. There are variations that 'open' the position and allow your right knee to draw up (as shown in your current position) but these are compromises that will affect your reliablility and comfort.
Second comment...you may want to consider other shooting gloves. Consider something like a Thune "solid" that has a fairly rigid rubber surface that helps manage some of the sling tension and resultant nerve pain/numbness.
HTH

Thanks for the observations. I will play around with my right leg and see how that changes the feel of the position. To make sure I understand correctly, you are saying the right leg might ideally be straight and moved out to an angle to the right that would be in line with the rifle, correct?

I will keep an eye out for a glove like the one you mentioned used and give it a try. Most of what I have now, including the rifle, is on an indefinite loan, or in the case of the glove you see was borrowed for competition.

I really appreciate the feedback

You are correct...the rifle barrel is basically in line with your right leg. Of course...results count, so experiment a bit to achieve perfection. The most common reason to pull your right leg forward is to raise your chest a bit for breathing. The starting angle between your L and R legs is recommended to be around 20 degrees. Your feet must not wiggle...keep them flat on their sides or if you are wearing boots with flat toes you can prevent wiggle with the flat toe in contact with the ground.
You may want to experiment with buttstock length to keep the tensions well balanced on your right shoulder, support hand, sling and elbows.

Your position looks pretty good. The only observation I have is that your position is a little low. You're legal, and your position looks perfect. Raising your position is more of an option to try if you would like.

Good luck at the match.

Soupy44 wrote:Your position looks pretty good. The only observation I have is that your position is a little low. You're legal, and your position looks perfect. Raising your position is more of an option to try if you would like.

Good luck at the match.

Thanks Soupy, I'm open to try anything if it might help me improve. As far as raising the position, would the correct way be to draw both elbows in closer and move back the handstop and sling accordingly?

Yep, and if your butt plate moves in and out of the stock, you'll want to move it in a bit too.

If you are having or developing problems in your prone position then I would suggest change. "If it ain't broke don't fix it"....however, that being said I feel you are too low and the left elbow needs to be more under the gun, as it should act as a pivot for adjusting your aim for the three lines of targets you face. Also with raising your left arm and elbow position your right elbow as well needs to come more towards your body so as to equalize the new left elbow position. That will make you hand naturally grip the rifle without tiring your wrists. I also suggest that when one has the advantage of a thumb hole stock to let your right thumb rest on the rifle stock rather than grasping the stock as you are doing now. This IMHO allows a more controlled and straight back trigger pull which is most desirable. The Crotchety Ole Coach----"Doc"

As always, Soupy's right on target.

Some obervations - your sight seems to be moved all the way back on your receiver. You might try sliding it up so the front of the assembly is at the "0" mark (if so labeled). If no labeling, then just about a 1/2 inch or so. If you moved it back to get good vision through it because of your position, then some adjustments are needed. I think that if you keep your left elbow and forearm at a 45 degree angle and get your right closer in line to the stock, you will find that the sight is too close and might be bumping into it. Like Soup said, you'll also move your handstop out a bit, and you will also probably need to adjust the sling, too.

Good luck, and tell us if this improves your stability, too!

Thanks again for all the replies everyone. I tried to incorporate some of these changes into my dryfiring tonight, and will be going to the range tomorrow to see how they work out. I'll post updates as to any improvements and maybe try to convince the wife to take a new set of pictures. thanks

Take a close look at photos six and seven. Note that your left foot position is different. I realize that this doesn't sound like much but any slight difference in position can change the pressures on the rifle causing it to recoil differently from shot to shot. I was told years ago thet if you curse ond the shot is a center, CURSE on every shot. The concept is to minimize change from shot to shot. I've shot many tens with my supporting hand completely numb. Try toughing it out in practice and see if that other point will come Good Shooting Bill Horton

I agree with soupy in that you look a little low. Shortening the sling and the handstop accordingly will lift you up, but also help relieve the excess pressure on your supporting hand. Once you've done that your elbows should naturally fall into a comfortable position, you may just need to tweek yourself to get it stable. Oh and note your shoulders should make a nice 'T' shape with your spine and yours appears a little asymetrical.

Rob.

Yup, you're a tad low. Bring in your handstop and shorten your sling and then leave well enough alone! You're too close to such an important match to start mucking around with your position and you're obviously doing a lot of things well -- don't introduce doubt at this stage.

Go for the experience, bring your camera and be a sponge and soak up as much of the event as you can. Being around so many other top-notch shooters can be a little overwhelming, but I think you'll find it elevates your own performance.

And you mentioned "conventional" targets -- are you shooting NRA or ISSF targets right now?

Jason

Jason wrote:Yup, you're a tad low. Bring in your handstop and shorten your sling and then leave well enough alone! You're too close to such an important match to start mucking around with your position and you're obviously doing a lot of things well -- don't introduce doubt at this stage.

Go for the experience, bring your camera and be a sponge and soak up as much of the event as you can. Being around so many other top-notch shooters can be a little overwhelming, but I think you'll find it elevates your own performance.

And you mentioned "conventional" targets -- are you shooting NRA or ISSF targets right now?

Jason

Jason,

Sorry, I should have elaborated a bit more. The club I shoot at only has the NRA 50 & 100yd targets available so that is what I primarily shoot. What I have been doing recently though, in order to prepare for the ISSF targets has been to shoot the 50yd NRA target and only count those shots that are solid 10x's as tens(normally 8-9 out of 10 shots), and discounting the rest as 9 or below(which I never really pay attention to anyway). Beyond the targets I try to set everything else up to ISSF rules from i.e. wind flags, equipment, etc.

I can't begin to tell you how excited I am about the match. I have been able to watch and learn so much from my local matches and states, but neither would be able to compare to the wealth of talent that I will encounter at Benning. It's going to be a blast.

Off to the range