TargetTalk

I have a 70 series 1911 gold cup that shoots very well. I am not trying to replace it, but have been considering a Beretta for an alternative. What needs to be done to a 92 to make it a bullseye pistol? What can be done by self, and what needs to be done by a 'smith? Lots of options, I am sure, maybe some guidelines and what to expect. Which model Beretta would you start as a base pistol?

I expect you are considering the Beretta for CMP "leg" matches. I've been down both roads. I shot a 1911 until I legged out. I later had Tony Kidd build a Beretta for me. IMHO, it really takes a custom pistolsmith to really build a proper Beretta ball gun. You need adjustable sights, custom barrel, and a way to fit the slide and frame together without excessive wear. The gun Tony recommended was a Beretta 92FS Brigadier, and that is what my base gun is. An M9 or Beretta 92FS will work. You may NOT use a Taurus or other versions of the Beretta, like the ninety-two, etc. In the right hands the Berettas have been dominating the CMP matches at Camp Perry, etc., but for the average Master and below shooter, I would recommend the 1911. The Beretta is more accurate, but the 1911 is more forgiving.

I have had very good luck with my beretta 92FS, I put on a drop in KKM barrel, a LPA rear sight, did my own trigger job... right to 4.1 lbs. It will not compete with a Sams or Mountain Comp. gun but it will get leg points in the right hands (just not mine yet!). I have been able to shoot 50 rounds on a 50 yard target and get all but two in the black. I haven't machine tested it yet but I would bet it will shoot 10 shots in to between 3 and 4 inches. I may not win a match with it but for about $650 I got a ball gun that will get me points.

Can we talk about how close you are able call your shots ? You indicate that you be;ieve your pistol shoots good enough leg with. If you do not have access to a testing rest you may be able to resolve this issue by keeping a close record of each shot and the call you made when the pistol fires.Shots within about 1 inch of your call would indicate that your evaluation of the pistols accuracy is valid. But, if your calls are further away than the average of one inch per shot you may be over estmating ther inherent accuracy of your pistol. It is very hard to develope a good shooting technique with an inaccurate pistol as the feed back you get on each shot can be misleading. Good Shooting bill Horton

Misny wrote:In the right hands the Berettas have been dominating the CMP matches at Camp Perry, etc., but for the average Master and below shooter, I would recommend the 1911. The Beretta is more accurate, but the 1911 is more forgiving.

Can someone let me in on what Misny is saying "The Beretta is more accurate, but the 1911 is more forgiving". Is he referring to durability?

Thanks.

Orion wrote:

Misny wrote:In the right hands the Berettas have been dominating the CMP matches at Camp Perry, etc., but for the average Master and below shooter, I would recommend the 1911. The Beretta is more accurate, but the 1911 is more forgiving.

Can someone let me in on what Misny is saying "The Beretta is more accurate, but the 1911 is more forgiving". Is he referring to durability?

Thanks.

I wholeheartedly agree that the Beretta is more accurate, but the 1911 is more forgiving.

The Beretta has a pivoting trigger. You can be fairly aggressive on a 1911 trigger. If you get too aggressive on most Beretta triggers, you will not shoot a good score.

NCST8 wrote:

Orion wrote:I wholeheartedly agree that the Beretta is more accurate

Heresy! Get the torches and pitchforks! We'll burn their castle down!!!

Wiley-X wrote:

NCST8 wrote:

Orion wrote:I wholeheartedly agree that the Beretta is more accurate

Heresy! Get the torches and pitchforks! We'll burn their castle down!!!

Aaaarrrrrrr!!!

Wouldn't a stock P210 still be cheaper and still deliver the accuracy.

:)
Speaking of heresy

It would, but it doesn't qualify for CMP matches. Those have to be fired with a military sidearm issued by the U.S.

The whole issue is one I've been considering.

The 1911 has the advantage of being a known quantity. There's plenty of gunsmithing support.

The Beretta has less recoil, useful in timed and rapid fire events. On the other hand, there are fewer gunsmiths capable of tuning one to match standard.

There is one question you need to ask yourself. Are you a bullseye shooter that also does service pistol, or are you a service pistol shooter that also does bullseye?

If you are a bullseye shooter, get the 1911. If you are a service pistol shooter, get the Beretta.

For now, all my goals are service pistol oriented. So, the Beretta is a no-brainer.

On a similar note..

What is the Beretta "Parabellum"? I see it on some 92FS', but not all of them.

Is this 92FS "Parabellum" CMP legal?

Thanks.

NCST8 wrote:There is one question you need to ask yourself. Are you a bullseye shooter that also does service pistol, or are you a service pistol shooter that also does bullseye?

A friend of mine decided he wanted to be a Service Pistol shooter and that Bullseye would be a distraction. The result is/was that he found the rule limiting a shooter to three matches per year (plus Camp Perry) made it hard for him keep up his training program and the guys who spent time training for and competing in 2700's made progress a lot faster.

Orion wrote:What is the Beretta "Parabellum"? I see it on some 92FS', but not all of them.

My 92 says "9mm Parabellum" which is the old name for the 9x19mm cartridge.

GOVTMODEL wrote:

NCST8 wrote:There is one question you need to ask yourself. Are you a bullseye shooter that also does service pistol, or are you a service pistol shooter that also does bullseye?

A friend of mine decided he wanted to be a Service Pistol shooter and that Bullseye would be a distraction. The result is/was that he found the rule limiting a shooter to three matches per year (plus Camp Perry) made it hard for him keep up his training program and the guys who spent time training for and competing in 2700's made progress a lot faster.

Not a problem in this case as this particular competitor comes to our local matches and shoots the 2700's with us. He uses open sights for everything and shoots his ball gun where it is allowed to get more experience and training for the EIC matches. He is just on a mission to earn his distinguished badge as his first priority where others often use dot sights and get better match scores but then have problems shooting open sight ball guns.

Clark

I have found that training at home with an iron sighted air pistol has pushed my LEG scores up. I still prefer to shoot with the dot in a 2700 mostly because of the advantage in timed and rapid fire,. I think the mistake most people make between a wad cutter 45 and a ball gun is that they get used to the 3.5 pound trigger and then have trouble getting agressive enough with the ball gun particularly in timed and rapid fire. As a friend of mine who is distingusihed and still wins a lot of LEG matches says you need to learn to really get on the trigger and mash it. If you don't you are behind and those sights are moving all over the place, Isabel

quote:
I have found that training at home with an iron sighted air pistol has pushed my LEG scores up.

What iron sight air pistol have you found that has a decent trigger?

Paul in WNY

catmandu wrote:quote:
I have found that training at home with an iron sighted air pistol has pushed my LEG scores up.

What iron sight air pistol have you found that has a decent trigger?

Paul in WNY

I use both my LP-10 and an LP-50 (steyr) The LP-10 is set up as a standard Olympic pistol with about a 540g trigger. The LP-50 has a heavier roll trigger in it that can be adjusted between up to 4 pounds and it will do five shots rapid fire.
http://www.steyr-sportwaffen.at/content ... nfo_50.pdf