TargetTalk

I witnessed an interesting occurence at a weekend competition for AP last Saturday.
One of the competitors used a 'backing target' behind the competition numbered target, for each series of ten shots.
That way, after 10 shots, he could see his score for those 10 and more importantly (for him) he could see the 10 shot grouping and make an necessary sight adjustments. (which he did) I noticed he was careful to have his backing target marked quite clearly. There was no way one could have mistaken it for one of his 60 competition targets. I was in the bay alongside him so it was easy for me to see. Many others didn't know, as when the target (s) are going up and down the carrier, they appear as one. The RO was quite aware and wasn't even enqisative or interested. I actually thought this was a great idea, especially since at the end of sixty shots you have six 'composite' targets to analyse. Wouldn't mind doing that myself next time. How does that stand with 'rules and regulations'?? I couldn't find anything in my rule book which covered that topic, but would think that David Levene, Spencer or other forum users may know. More so - whether it's permitable or not, is the backing target a good idea or not??

I can't think of a rule that would prohibit it John, and hope that there isn't one as I like the idea.

I personally don't think it is against the spirit of the rules as the shooter can only see the normal target and would be able to see the ten single shot targets anyway before placing them in position for collection.

It actually goes some of the way to negating one of the few "advantages" that electronic targets have over paper, the ability to see your group forming.

Barring someone giving me a rule number prohibiting it, or offering a compelling reason why it is against the spirit of the rules, I would (continue to) allow it.

I'm pretty sure I've seen people shoot with a backing cards at some of the national championships, like David I can't think of any rule that prohibits them but then I'm no master scholar of the rules.

Rob.

It has certainly been accepted practice when using single aiming mark air rifle targets. The purpose may be slightly different, blanking out the pellet catcher and making making the target a little more secure, but the effect is the same. I really cannot see anything wrong with the practice.

Rutty

However. If we were to be a little bizzarre about this, one would think that the practice of a backing target would not be allowed.
For example, if one was supremely confident, by placed two competition targets in together and then shooting a 10, creates a great result. (yes - I know there's arguement for shooting an 8 also) I know shooters who always (!!) claim they manage to shoot a 10 at the start of each 10 shot series - 'for some reason or other'. There's motive!!
More bizzarre, would be the acceptance of the 10 (of course) if that what was scored, but claim 'accidental error' of placing two targets together if the lower score eventuated. There's a tricky one for the RO.
What about the instance of running out of time. Maybe slipping a couple of targets together would help?
I'm in support of the idea from the viewpoint that there may be some 'feed back' information that would help with accesing ones competition performance - but allowing these bizzarre ideas to also be 'possibilities', must surely mean that somewehere in the rule book it states something about 'one target at a time'?????

Easy fix - the backer should be marked in the upper right corner just like the sighter target. In fact, rule or not, I would mark my backer like that just to keep people from thinking I was trying to pull something.

John Ariani wrote:However. If we were to be a little bizzarre about this, one would think that the practice of a backing target would not be allowed.
For example, if one was supremely confident, by placed two competition targets in together and then shooting a 10, creates a great result. (yes - I know there's arguement for shooting an 8 also) I know shooters who always (!!) claim they manage to shoot a 10 at the start of each 10 shot series - 'for some reason or other'. There's motive!!
More bizzarre, would be the acceptance of the 10 (of course) if that what was scored, but claim 'accidental error' of placing two targets together if the lower score eventuated. There's a tricky one for the RO.
What about the instance of running out of time. Maybe slipping a couple of targets together would help?
I'm in support of the idea from the viewpoint that there may be some 'feed back' information that would help with accesing ones competition performance - but allowing these bizzarre ideas to also be 'possibilities', must surely mean that somewehere in the rule book it states something about 'one target at a time'?????

All those things can and I'm sure have been done with or without using a backer. A backer in and of itself isn't going to make this any easier.

"I'm sure if I put 2 targets together and cranked them down, shoot them and brought them back, no one would even notice"

"I'm sure if I put 2 targets together and cranked them down, shoot them and brought them back, no one would even notice" - John Ariani

The (good) scorers will normally notice something different. The 'hole' in a second target is quite different.

Spencer

It's funny this topic should come up right now as I shot a match on the weekend and had to use a backing target because the match organiser used cheap targets that were tearing with every shot from my pistol. Luckily I had an Edelmann target with me and use it as a backer to prevent tearing. Obviously the Edelmann wasn't going to be mistaken as one of my "match" targets because the difference in target quality would have been easily discernable by even the most inexperienced eye.

As I was cranking targets back and forth I gave consideration to some of the points which have been raised in the discussion above, and was thankful that my backing target was so totally different from the match targets that my personal integrity could not possibly be called into question. If I had to use a backing target that was at all similar to the match targets I would deface the backer so that it appeared as a sighter target, and insert it in the target carrier so that I was shooting at the back side of the backer. That way scorers would easily see the holes in the backer target would all be made from the blank side rather than the face side.

One of the things I enjoy about competitive pistol shooting is that, for the huge majority of cases, the individuals involved in the sport conduct themselves with honesty and integrity. It would be very difficult for me to remain involved if I was always suspecting cheating was going on, or worse yet, if I were to be accused of cheating. Let's keep this an honourable game...

it is a good idea. so far, i have only seen rifle shooters using this technique. so it is not against the rule to use a backer?

and if so, what shd i use for the backer? a target card of my own, or one of the sighter cards provided in the competition?

.donthc wrote:it is a good idea. so far, i have only seen rifle shooters using this technique. so it is not against the rule to use a backer?

and if so, what shd i use for the backer? a target card of my own, or one of the sighter cards provided in the competition?

Let the Chief Range Officer know what you are going to do and ask what backing target he would prefer you use.

Remember that although we have not been able to find a rule prohibiting it, if the Jury decide it is against the spirit of the rules then you will not be allowed to do it. At least you will know before you start so will avoid any hassle during the match.