TargetTalk

An earlier post on FP grips got me to thinking... (and that's always a dangerous thing!).

I've never shot for any more than a few shots a pistol with a laminated wood grip. I've been wanting to make my own laminated grip using rock maple but have never really thought about what potential down-sides might be associated with such a design.

For those of you who have owned or used laminated wood grips, what are the pitfalls or disadvantages that I should be aware of before embarking on such a project?

As always, thanks in advance for your thoughtful replies.


Mark.

Mark,
I have a set of laminated Rink grips on my Toz. I had to do a bit of inletting, which I did without any problems. In fact the multi-color laminates made it easier to judge when I had removed sufficient wood. I have had no functional problems.

The other Fred begs to differ. If you are someone who works on the external shape of your grips to improve the hand-to-grip fit, laminated grips - based on my limited experience with them - are an abomination. The glue between the wood layers makes filing or sanding difficult, and even the Dremel will not cut across layers smoothly, due to the differing hardness of the layers and the glue. They also take stippling unevenly, if that's how you like to finish off the surface. As Fred M pointed out, the layers can make judgments of thickness easier, but that's about the only positive I can think of. As for appearance, the now-common gaudy colored laminates look - to me - trashy beside a handsome piece of walnut.

FredB

Fred wrote:The other Fred begs to differ. If you are someone who works on the external shape of your grips to improve the hand-to-grip fit, laminated grips - based on my limited experience with them - are an abomination. The glue between the wood layers makes filing or sanding difficult, and even the Dremel will not cut across layers smoothly, due to the differing hardness of the layers and the glue. They also take stippling unevenly, if that's how you like to finish off the surface. As Fred M pointed out, the layers can make judgments of thickness easier, but that's about the only positive I can think of. As for appearance, the now-common gaudy colored laminates look - to me - trashy beside a handsome piece of walnut.

FredB

I guess I'm fortuneate in not having to do any shaping on the external surfaces. I agree with your assessment of the problems, but disagree with your critique of the aesthetics. I think my multi-colored Rink grips are really good looking. :-)

FredM

I have laminated grips on my Steyr FP. I haven't tried to modify them. I like the looks and feel.

Bill

I have laminated Rinks for my GSP and had no problems modifying them with any of the common tools ie, dremmels, files or sand paper.

I belive that under certain conditions a laminate grip is stronger than wood. I know of a Rink walnut TOZ-35 grip than broke. The break occurred following the grain line of the rather thin part that curves over the top of the hand. In my laminate Rink TOZ-35 grip, this same part is stronger due to the cross grain of each laminate layer. I love a really nice piece of walnut, but I think my laminate grip is cool too.

Best Regards,
Slo cat

GO NAVY! BEAT ARMY!

I am a traditionalist. Guns should be blue and grips s/b wood but that really does not answer the original question does it?

You have to decide really whether you want a grip that looks pretty or one that fits your hand perfectly. You are highly unlikely to get both in the same package. To me a grip is nothing more than a tool and hence it gets chopped and filled so that it best fits me and helps my shooting. But hey if you're not too worried about getting the best fitting grip then go for something pretty.

Rob.

i just fitted my izh35m with a CM grip made from walnut. the left side had to be modified in such a way that the saftey lever would function. i had to file off a small notch for the lever to fit in (they made the morini grip for earlier models with no thumb saftey) this made the wood rather flimsy at that part of the grip. walnut is pretty darn soft.

As far as the positive aspects of laminated grips:
1. They are "stronger" in the sense of being less likely to crack or break along the grain. Since the different layers of wood will be laid in different grain directions, they can't really "break along the grain". Useful if you worry about dropping your pistol.

2. They are less likely to warp due to humidity or if they get wet. Dimensional stability, just like a sheet of plywood compared to a similarly-sized piece of "regular" wood.

#2 would be important for rifle shooters, since you've got a long piece of wood which comes close to, but does not touch, the barrel. If it were to warp it could contact the barrel. For pistols I'm not sure how much of an issue it is.

Fred wrote:As for appearance, the now-common gaudy colored laminates look - to me - trashy beside a handsome piece of walnut.

You and me both! When I bought the Rink grip for my Pardini FP, I went with plain walnut specifically because I thought his laminates were awful. Blue and orange layers and stuff like that ... what gets into people to think that's a good combination?! Laminates can look nice, but the colors have go together!

Nicole Hamilton wrote:

Fred wrote:As for appearance, the now-common gaudy colored laminates look - to me - trashy beside a handsome piece of walnut.

You and me both! When I bought the Rink grip for my Pardini FP, I went with plain walnut specifically because I thought his laminates were awful. Blue and orange layers and stuff like that ... what gets into people to think that's a good combination?! Laminates can look nice, but the colors have go together!

You have seen the colour combos on the shooting jackets right?

Hi Mark,
I have built grips from both laminate and walnut in the past, I now only do walnut.
The laminate is usually a softer timber getting its strength from the plies, easier on the tools and easier to shape.

It is easier to get accurate shapes using the lines of the plies, both on the inletting and external.
In is nearly impossible to stipple and will not take a oil finish. In fact it is difficult to get a good finish at all, unless you use a urethane finish.
Once finished (including factory grips) it is nearly impossible to alter,cut, fill and refinish to and sort of acceptable standard.

If you want to try laminate, use model aircraft ply (1/4" x 12 ply) and epoxy together to make a blank.
After inletting, to harden the inside and make if durible, soak the inner surface with super glue and let it soak in.

On the other hand, Walnut, is difficult to obtain good quality blanks and expensive. It is hard on your tools and take longer to work.
But once finished is a much better grip and in most cases will outlast the pistol.

Wow! I had no idea my simple question would stir such controversy and informed discussion!

My initial intent was to make an FP grip from multiple layers of rock maple, which in itself is usually considered both harder and stronger than walnut. The concept of a laminate was intended to provide strength in those areas where grips are traditionally structurally weak (yes, the advantage of alternating directions of the wood grain).

I personally don't enjoy the look of laminates using multiple colours, so my intent would be to use the wood in its natural colour and using a clear/transparent glue. The points about difficulties in machining caused by the varying densities of wood & glue is significant (and now causes me to scratch my head...). Likewise for the ability of the wood to take a stain or oil finish.

My thanks to all those who responded - your points are well made and gratefully received. That's the joy of this forum - being able to share diverse points of view without the constraints of time zones and geography getting in the way of sharing!