TargetTalk

I find I need some barrel weight on my M 162 to keep the muzzle from wandering, l start out with the weight about 2/3 down the barrel, it helps but feel too muzzle heavy, lately I moved the weight closer to the trigger and it seems to me I can obtain a better hold, haven't shoot enough with this setting to be sure and it also seems by just moving the weight a fraction of an inch will change the feel of the AP while shooting, am I become more sensitive? The more experienced AP shooters in our midst, how do you setup your barrel weight? Is there some kind of guideline or its by trial and error? Also, whats the best location for weights on an AP? On the barrel so its top heavy or under the barrel and in front of the trigger like the Walther CPM. Any thoughts?

Please go to - http://pilkguns.com/coach/sws.htm and to a post I made in Olympic Pistol to Bob259 on Saturday March 20, 2004.

It is an inexpensive solution for attaching weights on an air pistol. There should be no problem damaging the cylinder or pistol if you remove the weights before screwing the cylinder on or off the pistol. There is a lot of mass at the pistol/cylinder juncture once the cylinder is screwed on properly. Then the film cannister with weights is slipped on and adjusted. The tire weights are 7 grams (1/4 oz.) each. They have an adhesive strip, are easy to cut and can be shaped on any round shape (dowel, broom handle etc.) before attaching them to the film cannister. I have three sets of weights. It depends on how I feel that day.
Sandy Santibanez

Here is a long follow-up to the preceeding weight post.
1. There is little or no cost involved so experimenting with weight/balance is cost effective.
2. The plastic sleeve weighs 3g or less when trimmed. It grips well but can be moved easily on the cylinder so that experimenting for optimum weight/balance can be tried and tested.
3. The wheel weights are 7g each and are easy to cut and attach in fractions and/or multiples on the sleeve.
4. The weights can be positioned at lowest center gravity under the cylinder. If you cant your pistol they can be placed on the side so as to keep the center of gravity as low as possible.
5. Since fatigue can be a factor during a match, it is easy to change the balance (perceived weight) during a match by easily sliding the weight back fractions of an inch without releasing your grip on the pistol.
6. Some shooters like a heavier pistol and do not necessarily want all of the weight out on the end of the barrel. It just feels and shoots better for them. Perhaps it is physical, perhaps it is mental.

As humans we respond to many external stimuli and variables. We change the sights up, down, and even the width of the rear sight during a match depending on how the shots are grouping, the level of illumination, direction of the light, visual contrast, blood sugar, on how we feel at the time, etc. Grip are adjusted, the size of the irises are adjusted, if your back or shoulder gets tired, feet position may be adjusted, jackets removed or added to adjust body temperature, etc.
Why not the weight/balance adjustment since we are not an immutable part of a given equasion? Function and practical application that is easily adjustable to the many variables involved should be used with the theories.
For example of some limitations on my LP-10.
1. The weights are just over 10 grams each, and if that is your optimum weight, fine, however all the weight is on one side. I am not sure what the engeneering calculation for that is.
2. If the optimum wight is not a multiple of 10g (adding more weights) then you must cut or grind the metal weights, which is not easy to do to.
3. The weights are at barrel hight which is not optimum (tight-rope walkers keep the balancing weights below their feet on a tight-rope).
4. A shooter tends to not make changes since it is not easy to do.
5.The manufacturers components are fairly expensive so shooters are even more reluctant to make changes even if they think they should.

To get maximum jitter dampening, while using the least weight (to more easily hold the pistol arm up), you should put your added weight at the ends of the pistol. This gives much greater angular momentum than the same amount of weight in the middle, but is just the same for static balance.

The grip end, with your hand wrapped around it, probably already has plenty of weight. So put all your added weight at the end of the barrel. If that is too muzzle heavy, use less weight rather than moving it back toward the middle where it doesn't do any good.

Adhesive lead tape is sold in local sporting goods stores for use on tennis rackets. You can easily apply the amount you want to use, and peel off whatever seems too heavy after a test. You can stack multiple layers of lead tape rather than having part of it too far back.

Moment of inertia (read resistance to motion) is enhanced by weight at the muzzle. Weight added to the center of mass simply increases the weight and does nothing for dynamic motion. Zurick and a few others had weights that went on the bbl itself but I dont know the source or cost. I just started fooling with the film canister method and it feels nice.

Tony:

When I put the weight in the front of the pistol (muzzle), after 60 shoots, I feel a pain in the heel of the hand, and a red color of the skin can be looked.

I have to take the weight back a half inch and try again.
The perfect locating place is far of your hand, but dont hurt your hand.
¿Did you understand?

Nano

Nano wrote:Tony:

When I put the weight in the front of the pistol (muzzle), after 60 shoots, I feel a pain in the heel of the hand, and a red color of the skin can be looked.

I have to take the weight back a half inch and try again.
The perfect locating place is far of your hand, but dont hurt your hand.
¿Did you understand?

Nano

As Benjamin has pointed out, you should keep the weight at the end of the barrel. If it hurts your hand, reduce the amount of weight at the end of the barrel. Do not move the weight back. The added weight damps barrel motion because it increases moment of inertia, which is weight times the square of the distance from the weight to the center of gravity. You get more damping with less weight if you keep whatever amount of weight you use positioned at the end of the barrel.

Nano wrote: When I put the weight in the front of the pistol (muzzle), after 60 shoots, I feel a pain in the heel of the hand, and a red color of the skin can be looked.

I have to take the weight back a half inch and try again.
The perfect locating place is far of your hand, but dont hurt your hand.
¿Did you understand? Nano

Nano,

If the place on your hand where you feel the pain is at the very back of your hand, and if you have an adjustable grip, you might want to try changing the angle of the palm shelf a little. It sounds like all of the upward pressure from the palm shelf to your hand is in one small area. If you change the angle, you can spread that pressure over the whole bottom of your hand. On some grips, you need to remove a little from one of the vertical surfaces of the palm shelf, where it contacts the main part of the grip, in order to be able to change the angle.

HTH,
FredB

Fred:

Thank you for your opinions.
Please, i have other question.
How do you define the weight to use in Air Pistol? How do yo know if the weight is too much?

Thank you,

Nano

Nano wrote: How do you define the weight to use in Air Pistol? How do yo know if the weight is too much?

Nano,

For me, the overall weight is much less important than the balance. I have found I can hold and shoot a well-balanced heavy gun much better - and for a longer time - than an unbalanced light gun. Everyone has his or her own ideal balance, but once you have experimented and found the right balance for your gun for you, I don't think you will be aware of the overall weight. But before you can find the optimal balance, you need to get your grip adjusted so that it spreads the forces more evenly on your hand - that's what I was trying to say in my previous comment.

HTH,
FredB