TargetTalk

renzo wrote:Being things as they are, what I tried was to determine when should I grant an "inner ten" when using the electronic scorer, (...)
Please try to understand my predicament...

renzo wrote:There are certain circumstances in which you have to stray from the strict ISSF rules. As an example: 50 m. Prone Rifle and Air Rifle are to be scored in tenths all the way, that is, quali and OF.

hundert wrote:I guess those at the top don't care much for the average paper club.

renzo wrote:
As a fellow judge I ask you for advice (or opinion) in a matter that I had to deal in a match today, as I know you to be more knowledgeable and up-to-date with rule interpretations.

We were using for the first time - officially - our new DISAG scorer for paper targets, which was an enormous advance when scoring in tenths. As we haven´t set an interface with our match management program, we slipped the targets and set the machine to print the score on the paper, and then loaded the values in our spreadsheet (I hope our technician will sort this step promptly).

Anyways, I set the scorer to read in tenths even when the classification round was final and scored in natural points, because I needed to know if a hit was a "10" or an "inner ten". In all the refreshment courses I took we were always told that the only case that could bring any protest was in air rifle (we are talking about scoring with gauges) as the only rule to define an inner ten is to have the center point completely obliterated.

Obviously, the DISAG can´t "see" if the point is present or not, so we used the common practice of considering a shot value of 10.5 and over as an inner ten, and 10.4 or lower as a natural ten, which I always took as true, not taken into consideration other targets as they have a clearly drawn line defining it, and must be treated with the same criteria as any line scoring.

hundert wrote:I hope some of you with enough influence will change targets alltogether. They were made in mind to make the maximum score "almost" possible, but unreachable.

In air pistol, the integers are waaaay to crude.
Shooting 9.9 is about 4 times as precise as 9.0, yet both are scored the same.
When shooting tenths, they're too small and it's difficult for beginners to to see if it's a 10.3 or 10.5 if they don't shoot electronic.

I think in AP, the 10 must be at least twice as big in diameter and then always scored in tenths, then you could actually print the tenth.

I've shot a series of "only" 94 in competition, with 3 x 9.9 and all other nines close to the 10. It may have been scored close to a 100.0 in tenths. A typical 94 Series scores something like 97.0 in tenth. Shooting 97.0 in finals is death, you'll fly out first or second, shooting a 100.0 keeps you in the medals.
Losing 3 points due to a flawed system is retarded. Kind of unfair being punished for shooting better.

I guess those at the top don't care much for the average paper club.

TLDR: you can shoot two series of exactly 90 points. One of those series could be up to 4 times as precise as the other, because of how big the rings are. That's super retarded.

jenrick wrote:I ended up getting an app for my phone called TargetScan, that can score in integer or decimal. It will read a target much like Orion and generate shot plots, scores etc. No it's not electronic scoring, you've got to let it scan the target after the shot. However when shooting Air Rifle on a 12 bull target, it's quick and easy to get 10 shots on record in decimal. For something like free pistol where it'd be rare to be stacking shots on top of each other it works great for 5-10 shots (depending on how well you shoot), on each target. Best $5 I've spent in a long time.

-Jenrick

hundert wrote:you both are wrong, there's a reason rifles aren't shot with integers any more.

a score of 599 could be more precise than 600 by A LOT. And it's indeed the case in real competitions.

In bench rest competitions you aren't even allowed to shoot a 9. If you do, you're out. With integers of course. With tenths, if you shoot deep 10s, you can afford a mistake, because you'll outdo others with your deep 10s.

I'm not sure how fair is it to let someone shoot four times as bad and win over the guy who shoots four times better. Look at the AP target, I have 500 of them in front of me, look how big the difference between a 9.9 and a 9.0 is, it's YUGE. Why the hell being more precise does not translate into a better score?