scoping

[Tycho]

Haven't seen many people using a scope when shooting e-targets...

[john bickar]

The other (extremely important) reason is, when shooting on electronic targets, you must challenge a zero immediately (6.15.4.2.1), before firing the next shot.

I think you mean 6.16.6.2 John.

Welcome to 2013 ;-)

WE ARE LIVING IN THE FUTURE :-O

[Gerard]

The other (extremely important) reason is, when shooting on electronic targets, you must challenge a zero immediately (6.15.4.2.1), before firing the next shot.

If not, you own it.

So if you ever plan on shooting on EST any time, anywhere, you simply must have it in your shot plan that you verify every shot.

This is interesting, in a moderately depressing sort of way. So I guess my question would be 'what is the failure rate for ISSF-standard electronic scoring targets?' Any idea? I've watched a lot of ISSF World Cup AP matches and haven't noticed anyone protesting a result. Are there known examples in a final? Or in a qualifier? If the rate is significant - say, 1 in 10,000 shots or worse - then it would indeed seem logical that every serious shooter should adopt a scope routine into their shooting plan. I for one am not hugely enthusiastic about this. I like my kit to be in one case, easily portable, as I don't drive and it'd be awkward transporting a scope and a small tripod in addition to my Pelican case.

I've only been shooting for 2.5 years but my results in home practice have been showing some serious improvement lately, and I'm optimistic that I should likely advance to Master status in the next match or two, and might be facing electronic targets within the next couple of years. If I'm to adopt a scoping routine in club and match scenarios I'd like to start soon so as to make it less significant psychologically in the longer term. I do scope routinely at home, every shot in some sessions, every 5 shots in other sessions. At the club I don't bother. As I said, too annoying carrying the gear on the bus. But if SIUS is messing up significant numbers of results I'll change that and make shot-by-shot scoping a part of my routine always so it 'disappears' as does loading etc in the routine.

[David Levene]

.... then it would indeed seem logical that every serious shooter should adopt a scope routine into their shooting plan.

That would be pretty pointless on ESTs, theres not a lot to see.

Also, remember a telescope isn't allowed under ISSF rules for air pistol.

[bpscCheney]

I saw a shooter protest a shot at the NRA Intercollegiate Championships this past year, it didn't work out for them (She claimed she shot a 9 in kneeling but had actually shot a 4). They can look at the black film IIRC and see the shot placement and determine if it was a scoring error or not; they're not going to change an 8.9 to a 9.0 but they would have you reshoot the shot, and if the target is still malfunctioning they would move you to a different target (Saw that this year too). Remember the SIUS-Ascor targets are the only ESTs endorsed by the ISSF for all events, there's probably a reason for that.

[rmca]

So I was shooting along and looking after every shot. after 4 I had 3 x's and 1 10. Now the pressure started to build.....6. Bummer.

Not to pick on you, Chris (OK, maybe a little ;), but this is the argument that I most commonly hear against scoping every shot.

Often people will avoid scoping every shot as a crutch against the internal "pressure" that they feel as a "good" target starts to develop.

In doing so, they are tacitly acknowledging a weakness in their mental game plan, and stubbornly refusing to take any steps to overcome it.

Conversely, they way to learn how to shoot 100s is to put yourself in the position of having 9 10s on a target as often as possible.

Once in awhile you read something that makes you think twice about things...

I've been in a situation here I had a very nice group of shots and then screw it up with a bad one... Always blamed myself for scoping when I knew the shots were good, and added additional unnecessary pressure.

I will change the way I look at this situation... After all, as you said, if you want a 100, you have to see a 10, 20, 30, 40, 50, 60, 70, 80 and 90 first.

A very big THANK YOU John

[rickard9]

There appears a lot of disagreement on this topic. I last shot FP in 1970 and remember mystruggles since then. AP carries on now while the processing continues for a FP licence. And AP doesn't require a scoping regime if you can pull the target. But the same principle applies. I like the idea when I start FP of cutting out the 9 and 10 ring( orwhatever) of a target and then shooting for months without changing the target and hoping not to put any holes in it at all (lol).The best advice here appears to be to scope every shot after calling it(in my case I write it down) and make scoping part of the whole routine. I know it trains a tremendous brain-eye-triggerfinger relationship, and to not scope every shot puts one in la la land of "I am shooting so well now so will continue on my dream of just concentrating on sights and trigger and forget the target until morning tea time"To separate out good advice here from "experimentation", does anyone know what Don Nygord ever said on this topic?

[rickard9]

Hell, that last post of mine sounded like I was regarding good advice as experimentation. I wasn't. Rover's was the most succinct and others echoed him and that's good enough for me. I was just reading Nygord's stuff and succinctness is beautifully mixed with humour. Thanks guys (polishes off the old scope).

[Chris]

John,

I am always open to trying new things. I like your perspective and will try it out tomorrow at a match. I do understand the benefits of the positive feed back at seeing any result good or bad. This does provide some feedback to help you get a better understanding of your performance and ability to correct for mistakes.

I do know when I was shooting at matches with EST's I did look at every shot. I also know I did buckle under the pressure. I was on track to shoot a 560 in FP and ended up with a 545. I had a strung 3 97's in a row and then shot an 83 on the last string. I was so drained and appointed. At least I held onto 6th in the final.