38 Special -What velocity for an accurate centerfire load?

[Oversight]

Hello,

I am going to give the centerfire match a go with my new (2nd hand) S&W 586 .38/.357.

I was wondering if anyone could dig up some of their accuracy testing results and tell me what the best velocities were for accuracy with....

.38 brass and 148 grain Hollow based Wad Cutter projectiles (Hornady).

There is plenty of previous discussion regarding powders, but it's all Greek to me as many of the listed powders are not available here in NZ. (I will be using AP50N by ADI powders, an Australian manufacturer). So perhaps we could talk in average velocity's instead.

I am used to driving bullets around 800-900 ft/sec but realize that may be a bit faster than required for an ISSF match with these projectiles.

I would be interested if you had any velocity vs accuracy comparisons shooting from at least 25m (27 yards).

Cheers

[Fred Mannis]

Hello,

I am going to give the centerfire match a go with my new (2nd hand) S&W 586 .38/.357.

I was wondering if anyone could dig up some of their accuracy testing results and tell me what the best velocities were for accuracy with....

.38 brass and 148 grain Hollow based Wad Cutter projectiles (Hornady).

There is plenty of previous discussion regarding powders, but it's all Greek to me as many of the listed powders are not available here in NZ. (I will be using AP50N by ADI powders, an Australian manufacturer). So perhaps we could talk in average velocity's instead.

I am used to driving bullets around 800-900 ft/sec but realize that may be a bit faster than required for an ISSF match with these projectiles.

I would be interested if you had any velocity vs accuracy comparisons shooting from at least 25m (27 yards).

Cheers

Just had a look at my loading notes from my PPC days - a Powers Custom built on a 586 frame. Most loads were 148 gr WC in 357 cases loaded to 750-800 f/s. Shooting from sandbag rest, iron sights, groups were 2 to 4 in at 50 yd. Bullets were seated flush and roll crimped. I did not like shooting 38 cases because of the lead build up in the 357 chamber. A real pain to clean! I found that the accuracy was very dependent on bullet diameter relative to barrel dimensions and cylinder mouth diameter. My barrel had a groove diameter of 0.355" and land diameter of 0.350". The cylinder mouth would just pass a 0.357" bullet. Found that groups with 148WC sized to 0.3565" were better than groups fired with bullets sized to 0.3560" or 0.3575". Most factory lead bullets are made to 0.358" diameter.

Hornady 148HBWC worked well, but I found a local shooter who made excellent 148 WC solid base bullets sized to my spec for less cost and just as accurate. I preferred 700X powder, but 231 and Bullseye also worked well.

[jackh]

This is a collection of my notes filed from several sources. I do not know how much it will be useful if you are limited to Kiwi powder.

Federal and Winchester factory spec is 710fps for 148 HBWC target ammo

From Saturday it appears the the same load will go different speeds in different guns.
Also same load and gun, different brand HBWC will go different speeds.


From a top reloader:
148 HBWC
there are so many good loads that I will list some:
2.7 grs Bullseye
3.1 grs W231
2.5 grs VVN310
2.9 grs HodgdonTiteGroup or AA#2


From another top pistol smith:
The best groups I have been able to achieve in 38 were
with WST<<<<2.6 to 2.9 depending the particular gun...
2.7 was the average.../
Rem. Bullets<<<<<<148 HBWC/
once fired Rem. Cases and Fed. Primers.
231 shot some awesome groups and won a lot of matches also
(tends to produce a lot of gritty ash ), but WST is my favorite.
Try 2.5 - 2.8 WST; Rem brass; Fed. primers. I predict your
happiness... shooting 148 WC


My own data:
Chronographed from Colt revolver
148HBWC "National" brand - Not a typical HBWC
(three 5 shot strings averaged)
2.7 WST >>>>725fps 719fps 729fps
Same load of Nationals from S&W model 14
3 strings...695, 675, 694

Typical HBWC's also in Colt
Star, Speer, and another unknown 148
also all 2.7 WST >>>> 700, 668, 690


148 HBWC Speer in S&W
2.7 BE 650fps boost it to 2.8
3.0 231 CCI prime profile crimp .366-.367 698 fps excellent

231 powder will be position sensitive in the case.

[JamesH]

Winchester factory Super-X match loads ~700 fps from a 6" K38 seems to be the benchmark.

2.7gr AP50 gave 750fps for me with Bullzi 148 HBWC although it doesn't burn all that cleanly at the low pressure of 0.38 special.

Bullseye is a better bet if you can get it. Accuracy and velocity spread are better.

[Guest]

One of the greybeards reported to me that the best velocity for the 38 w/wadcutters was 725 ft/sec to 750 ft/sec.

[Fortitudo Dei]

As an aside, you may like to consider trying Vihtavuori powder some time in the future. It is available in NZ (in the North Island at least) and IMHO, is better in almost every respect to ADI (except that it costs more). I bought some N310 for reloading my .32's last year and wouldn't consider going back to ADI.
N310 burns blisteringly fast though so N320 is better suited for .38.

[Nev C]

My favorite load for my K38 was 2.7 gns of AP50N behind a 148gn HBWC.
This gave an average velocity of 700 fps and was very accurate.