Poor Target Quality Revisited

[pgfaini]

Some time back, there was a thread concerning the poor quality of some air pistol targets. One of the targets getting complaints about poor tag-board quality, resulting in ragged holes, and difficulty scoring, were the B-40 targets made by The American Target Company.
I defended these targets, based upon my own experience with them years ago. I stated that the tag-board was heavier than that of the National Target Co., so much so, that it required more postage to mail American Target Co. targets used in postal matches. They also cut cleaner holes than the National Target Co. targets.

Well, I finally got down to my last pack of 500 B-40 targets, (Purchased about six years ago), and called in an order to the American Target Co. in Denver. I made it a point to ask him if they’d recently changed the paper, because I’d heard complaints about the problems of pellets tearing ragged holes. His answer was that “they’re the same paper everyone else is using”. I ordered 1M B-40/1 targets.

When the package came, looking at the size of the carton, I thought they’d sent the wrong targets, maybe B-40/4’s. Inside, I found two packs of B-40/1 targets, but the packs didn’t look quite right. Upon bringing them down to my basement range and comparing them to the six year old remaining pack, I discovered that the new packs stood almost ½” shorter than the old pack. This couldn’t be attributed to the possibility of the old pack absorbed moisture, because it still had the band of paper wrapped around it, so the new targets were certainly thinner. Examining the targets themselves bore this out. I won’t even bother to mike them, since I used them in two 60 shot training sessions, and many of the holes were too ragged to use my outside gauge when scoring.

I’ll use them up in training, but I’m saving the old pack for postal matches. Sorry this is so long, but I just wanted to warn anybody that might be contemplating purchasing American Target Co. targets based upon my prior posting.

Paul

[JulianY]

His answer was that “they’re the same paper everyone else is using”.

Well that says it all - no pride in their own product !

I do hope they are listening , but after that i doubt their care

Maybe Scott should stock Edelmann if he does not already, though i dare say the price may surprise the US

JY

[F. Paul in Denver]

I live here in Denver, I have visited American Targets and their AP targets in fact, STINK.

[Matt]

Try Cibles Targets. I have been using them for three years and I can shoot ten shots into a bull with no tearing. I cut small cardboard squares and tape them onto the back of each bull. The holes are clean and can be scored with any plug. And the targets are of high quality. And I might also add that they are very reasonable in price!

Matt

[Walter Young]

I also like the Cibles targets.
There is also Krüger, which are as good as Edelmann and might have even more target style choices for training. I don't know what the differences in prices are though.

[joe4702]

I'll reiterate the previous posts. The American Target Co targets are poor quality. I bought a chrony to check my LP10, thinking low velocity was causing the tearing. Its running 525fps with 7.0g R10s - plenty fast.

I then tried some Cibles targets and they cut clean even with heavier pellets running at 475 fps. The Olympic Marksman Equipment store on Ebay sells Cibles 103T AP targets for $11.25/250. Note the training targets (stock# 103TT) at $15/500 are much thinner paper, but even they cut cleaner than the American Targets. The Ebay seller, Nick, also has good prices on traps, pellets and other accessories. Shipping time from Canada is a bit slow however. I have no connection to the seller other than as a satisfied customer.

[JoeG]

I've tried all of the above with the exception of the Krugers that were mentioned in one post. The Cibles were the next best I have come across so far. My top choice remains Edelmann which I do buy from our host Pilkington. They are pricier but in the long run they are well worth the difference. I generally shoot ten shots per bull in practice and I never have a problem reading my results, even with some of my lower velocity single stroke pneumatics. I do also make a point of keeping my supply in airtight ziploc bags to keep them dry and fresh. This works well, especially since I usually buy a decent amount and keep them for a long time. Joe G.

[Fred Mannis]

Try Cibles Targets. I have been using them for three years and I can shoot ten shots into a bull with no tearing. I cut small cardboard squares and tape them onto the back of each bull. The holes are clean and can be scored with any plug. And the targets are of high quality. And I might also add that they are very reasonable in price!
Matt

Matt,
I do just the opposite. I cut an 8 ring size hole in a cardboard backer and position the bull over the hole. Instant feed back (different impact sound) on poor shots! Maybe some day I will move to a smaller hole.
Fred

[Ed Hall]

I too, have had terrible results with the AP targets from American. I'm quite pleased with all their other products I've used, but I constantly have huge tears in the APs. I've often wondered if baking them would make a difference as described in the older archives, but have been shy about actually trying it.

Discussion on "Home Baked targets" from Jan 2000:

http://www.pilkguns.com/arch/arch047.htm

Also a thread from Dec 2003:

http://www.targettalk.org/viewtopic.php?t=7298

Take Care,
Ed Hall
http://www.airforceshooting.org/
http://www.starreloaders.com/edhall/

[F. Paul in Denver]

Ed,

That's a good idea which we tried here in Denver about a year ago. Even coming out of the oven in our relatively dry climate - no success with cleaner holes.

[pgfaini]

I suspect the fibres are to long, too strong, and probably running in one direction. All the one hole tears in mine, are running left to right, about 1/8" wide, and 1/2" long, on the right side of the hole. I would guess short chopped fibers would work better. If I get two holes, It's sometimes hard to tell which one has two shots, and which three.

I've given up on mine, and will use them for sighting in scopes. Opened my last pack of the old ones, and they're working fine. I'm tempted to call American Target back, and suggest if possible, they go back to the paper they used on these. No savings in material cost is worth the bad press they're getting with these targets. I also purchase my B-19 targets and centers from them, but haven't run into any problems (not with the size of my FP groups) :>)

[Guest]

You can always use the American AP targets for FP at 50'. They're a shade too big, but they're dern close.

[DLindenbaum]

Here's a technique that worked for me. I had a supply of the lesser quality targets given to me by a friend and of course they tear easily. I cut the corners from some of the used Edelmann targets (just a square of the white). Getting four pieces per target, the pile grows quicky. Using some roll-on glue stick, stick a piece on the back of a cheap target in the center. Now you get good holes! Takes no time and you get rid of the cheap targets.

Dennis