Beginning in Air Pistol

Kristin · Post by **Kristin** » Sun Nov 12, 2006 11:07 am

Hey y'all!

I am beginning in air pistol. I am in the middle of trying to set up my own range in my house and till now have only been dry-firing a Daisy 717 that I borrowed from a friend at my gun club.

Now I want to buy my own beginning Air Pistol. I know eventually I will want to invest in a really nice one (a steyr maybe), but for now I just want something that will be comfortable in my hand and accurate. Also, I'm in graduate school right now so spending big bucks is not much of an option. I'd like to stay under $350.

What do you guys recommend? Is Daisy the best option or are there other brands that are just as good or better? If Daisy is the best, what is the difference between a 717 and 747?

Thanks for your help!

randy1952 · Post by **randy1952** » Sun Nov 12, 2006 12:11 pm

I would consider a TAU 7 Junior if you don't want to put to much into the pistol. I think if you can do a little searching on price the pistol can be bought for somewhere between $380 to $435. If you have large hands you will probably have to go to a full size TAU 7, which will cost more. It has been used successfully by many juniors at the Junior Olympics. Scott has both the 747 and TAU 7 Junior.

The difference between the 717 and 747 can be best described reading a test article on the following website: http://home.att.net/~jjaxelrod/air.html. The 717 had been discountinued, but if your interested the sporting goods store where I work has one I think for around $70 or $80 plus shipping. The pistol can apparently shoot as well as a 747 after a barrel break-in process and according to the writeup a shooter did win a silver medal with the pistol. The pistol is brand new, but the box has been sitting in the store so long that the color on the box has started faded from the sunlight. I can check if your interested by emailing me at randys@bigskytel.com.

Kristin · Post by **Kristin** » Sun Nov 12, 2006 12:27 pm

randy1952 wrote:
The difference between the 717 and 747 can be best described reading a test article on the following website: http://home.att.net/~jjaxelrod/air.html.

Randy,

Can you resend link because this one doesn't work.

Thanks

randy1952 · Post by **randy1952** » Sun Nov 12, 2006 1:07 pm

Go to Google Search Engine and type: difference between Daisy 717 or 747 and the website should be at the top of the list.

TargetTerror · Post by **TargetTerror** » Sun Nov 12, 2006 1:27 pm

I'd look at the Baikal IZH-46M. It's about $280, very accurate, very nice trigger, and is a SSP so there is no extra money to invest in CO2 or compressed air equipment. Grips are a bit big, but can either be sanded down to fit or there are aftermarket grips as well.

randy1952 · Post by **randy1952** » Sun Nov 12, 2006 2:10 pm

The IZH46M is a good pistol and the Russians put it to good use when they were using them. If you want to save a few bucks it is priced between what you are looking at presently and an entry level gas gun. The IZH 46M probably would be a better pistol then the 747 at close to the same price However, if it were me and I was going up to those level of dollars I would choose the entry level gas gun the TAU 7.

GaryBF · Post by **GaryBF** » Sun Nov 12, 2006 3:22 pm

Kristin,
I own both the Daisy 717 and Baikal IZH-46M. In my opinion the IZH-46M is far superior to either Daisy model. You've seen the Daisy 717-it's made of pot metal and plastic. The grip shape is terrible and there is nothing you can do to change it. Although the Izzy has its faults, at least you can work with it. Use the search feature at the top of the page and you will find much discussion on the Izzy. My personal experience is documented in an essay entitled "IZH-46M Divorce". In spite of my eventual divorce, the IZH-46M is a good starter pistol and a bargain at the price. Good luck.
Gary

Kristin · Post by **Kristin** » Sun Nov 12, 2006 4:41 pm

Yeah, I've been looking at the Baikal IZH today online. I really hate the grips on the Daisy so the fact that the Baikal offers the possibilitie of grip upgrades is a good thing! I shy away from the CO2 gun because like TargetTerror pointed out I really don't want to spend money on a CO2 tank and getting it filled and all that. The precision guns use compressed air and already have that stuff for my air rifle. Thanks for the input!

Slo cat · Post by **Slo cat** » Mon Nov 13, 2006 12:41 am

Kristin,
There is a used Feinwerkbau Model 65 for sale for $325 plus shipping on TargetTalk at http://www.targettalk.org/viewtopic.php?t=14314

At one time, this was the state-of-the-art airpistol.

Best Regards,
Slo cat

Mike Taylor · Post by **Mike Taylor** » Mon Nov 13, 2006 1:45 am

Kristin,
On another thread in this forum, there is advertised:
"Gamo Compact right handed $175.00 Purchased new 09-27-2006. ...
Ken Rihanek"
I shot this model at my club a few years ago. It is, in my estimation, a better pistol than a Daisy 717 (which I owned at the time). For sure, the Gamo has a far better grip. The price is within your budget.
I have no financial interest in the Gamo and I do not know the seller. Just thought it seemed like a good chance for you to get an entry air pistol at a price that suited you.
What do others say?
Mike T.
PS Found this review of the pistol:
http://www.reviewcentre.com/review123299.html

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Mon Nov 13, 2006 1:59 am

If you can try Feinwerkbau Model 65, is very good pistol, better than izzy (more balanced and good grip) and a lot of way from gamo and tau and daisy. With a Fwb 65 you can go on score with your budget.

JulianY · Post by **JulianY** » Mon Nov 13, 2006 3:57 am

I am going to second the gamo compact, I have had mine over 15 years now, still going stong and have shot over the 500 with it. In the UK they are most popular pistol for Triathlon competitors!

It will give you all the basics untill you decide to go to a top quality gun

Julian

Kristin · Post by **Kristin** » Mon Nov 13, 2006 9:23 am

Slo cat wrote:Kristin,
There is a used Feinwerkbau Model 65 for sale for $325 plus shipping on TargetTalk at http://www.targettalk.org/viewtopic.php?t=14314

At one time, this was the state-of-the-art airpistol.

Best Regards,
Slo cat

Thanks for the info. What say you about buying used guns? Yay or Nay...I'm on the fence.

I also checked out the Gamo that Mike recommended. Is this a better quality than the IZH? A friend from my gun club can get me an IZH for right around 200$ new.

Fred Mannis · Post by **Fred Mannis** » Mon Nov 13, 2006 9:55 am

Kristin wrote:
Slo cat wrote:Kristin,
There is a used Feinwerkbau Model 65 for sale for $325 plus shipping on TargetTalk at http://www.targettalk.org/viewtopic.php?t=14314
At one time, this was the state-of-the-art airpistol.
Best Regards,
Slo cat
Thanks for the info. What say you about buying used guns? Yay or Nay...I'm on the fence.
I also checked out the Gamo that Mike recommended. Is this a better quality than the IZH? A friend from my gun club can get me an IZH for right around 200$ new.

Kristin, my 2 cents FWIW. The FWB65 is definitely a better pistol than the IZH, but it is over $100 more. Either pistol will get you to A class or better. Major difference is the weight and balance, the feel of the gun. Only you can decide that.
Pilkington will stand behind his used guns, so I don't see that as an issue. The best way to check out any used SSP is to have the owner provide a current velocity reading. This will tell you whether the cylinder seals need to be replaced.
The Gamo compact is not in the same league as the FWB and IZH. It is an OK beginner's gun, but you will outgrow it long before the other two.
Welcome to the world of AP :-)
Fred

David Levene · Post by **David Levene** » Mon Nov 13, 2006 1:24 pm

Mike Taylor wrote:On another thread in this forum, there is advertised:
"Gamo Compact right handed $175.00 Purchased new 09-27-2006. ...
Ken Rihanek"
I shot this model at my club a few years ago. It is, in my estimation, a better pistol than a Daisy 717 (which I owned at the time).

I'm sorry but I cannot keep quiet on this one any longer.

Over the years I have seen many Gamo Compacts being used at club level and by youth organisations at national level here in the UK.

IMHO the trigger alone is responsible for losing the sport too many young participants. It is truly terrible.

Mike Taylor · Post by **Mike Taylor** » Mon Nov 13, 2006 1:58 pm

Well there you go!
David has experience of many Gamo Compact pistols while I have tried but one. I have owned Daisy 717 and Feinwerkbau 65. Best to worst, I would rate my experience as: Fwb 65, Gamo Compact, Daisy 717.
I've handled the IZH 46, but not shot it. Nevertheless, I would suggest that if you can get a new IZH 46 (or 46M) for around $200, go for it.
As a comparison, my club has a new IZH 46M for sale, but we are asking CDN$450 (about US$400).

JulianY · Post by **JulianY** » Mon Nov 13, 2006 3:38 pm

David Levene wrote: Over the years I have seen many Gamo Compacts being used at club level and by youth organisations at national level here in the UK.

IMHO the trigger alone is responsible for losing the sport too many young participants. It is truly terrible.

please explain.

Mike S-J · Post by **Mike S-J** » Mon Nov 13, 2006 3:48 pm

Kristin,

13 months ago I was in the same situation as you. Not much money to spend, just starting AP and looking at a gun that would enable me to blossom if I had any skill, that wouldn't break the bank, and that I could sell if I turned out to be a moose with fins (vis-a-vis pistol shooting).
I read the threads and decided that I was better off spending my £260 on a gun with a good trigger. So second-hand it was - I settled on a Walther CPM-1 bought from a very good German dealer who also maintains, restores and tests guns. OK - so it was CO2 - no sweat for me - I have loads of the stuff at work.
Fantastic gun - I learnt the basics, got to love it - even bought myself a Rink grip for it. Eventually I got to the stage where I realised I liked shooting, I was OK at it, and a second-hand, hardly used LP10 came on the market. I bought the LP-10 and sold my Walther (on this forum) for only a negligable loss. Actually I wish I hadn't sold it now - but at the time I was short of cash.
So the morals of my story are (1) cheap-skates can only afford quality triggers if they are second hand and (2) nothing wrong with old technology with a pedigree to see you on the right path. If nothing else, you will be able to sell it on for what you paid. Not so for a new Gamo, or Daisy I'd wager.
Good luck me old cock-sparrow. hope this helps.
M.

John Ariani · Post by **John Ariani** » Mon Nov 13, 2006 7:31 pm

And...if you never got to read the post by Gary BF "IZH-46M divorce" - you must.
Very cleverly written - wonderful sense of humor - great reading.

Kristin · Post by **Kristin** » Mon Nov 13, 2006 10:59 pm

I hear you Mike S-J. It sucks to be a shooter and be poor graduate students. I have found, however, that friends in the shooting world are very generous in letting me borrow and try out their guns. My husband laughs at me because my best friends are men old enough to be my father at the gun club.

So how does the muzzle weight of the IHZ compare to the Daisy 717 that I've been dry firing?

I've been doing some high repetition upper arm and shoulder exercises with a two pound weight before bed. As soon as the two pounder doesn't make me feel the burn I'll uprade to a three pounder.

This is all so interesting...

TargetTalk

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On Reading about the Divorce