can anybody help me for final
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can anybody help me for final
I am very unsuccesful about the final.I always enter the final after the competition but I see myself 7th 8th.My finals are very bad.I dont know what I can do about this.Thanks for helps...
Sounds like a mental problem to me.
You need to remember you are just shooting a single shot - exactly like you did in the match and all your training. Focus on the shot process and ignore the situation. Practice and relaxation techniques will help you to remain calm. Remeber you do it all the time in training, the finals is no different.
Rob.
You need to remember you are just shooting a single shot - exactly like you did in the match and all your training. Focus on the shot process and ignore the situation. Practice and relaxation techniques will help you to remain calm. Remeber you do it all the time in training, the finals is no different.
Rob.
Shooting under pressure is what magnifies weakness in a shooting technique.
Most people practice a technique that only works well under the BEST of conditions. When pulse rate is low, shooter is comfortable, not distracted, not nervous.
Any trigger technique that relies on ultra-fine motor control is going to be suicidal when you're not as relaxed/confident/focused as you are on your home range.
If you think top shooters don't get nervous, think again. They have in many cases developed a technique that does not rely on being calm, that works under the WORST of conditions.
Okay, you can go the forced-relaxation route, and if you're very lucky you may get some success from it. I could calm myself quite successfully, right up until the first "START".
Basically a shooting technique that relies on a positive trigger pressure (no stalling), a surprise release within a window of your best hold (maybe 3-6 seconds after arriving in the aiming area) and the courage to commit to it, has the best chance of long-term success. Especially for shooting Finals, but of course this should be used all the time.
I guess that's enough heresy for one day.
Most people practice a technique that only works well under the BEST of conditions. When pulse rate is low, shooter is comfortable, not distracted, not nervous.
Any trigger technique that relies on ultra-fine motor control is going to be suicidal when you're not as relaxed/confident/focused as you are on your home range.
If you think top shooters don't get nervous, think again. They have in many cases developed a technique that does not rely on being calm, that works under the WORST of conditions.
Okay, you can go the forced-relaxation route, and if you're very lucky you may get some success from it. I could calm myself quite successfully, right up until the first "START".
Basically a shooting technique that relies on a positive trigger pressure (no stalling), a surprise release within a window of your best hold (maybe 3-6 seconds after arriving in the aiming area) and the courage to commit to it, has the best chance of long-term success. Especially for shooting Finals, but of course this should be used all the time.
I guess that's enough heresy for one day.
With respect, I have to disagree. What distinguishes good shooters from others is their ability to control their nerves not the fact that they shoot through them. 'Nerves' or a degree of anxiety, stress - call it what you like - are a requirement for optimal shooting performance but go too far and everyone will shake and wobble and their performance WILL get much worse. The skill is to mentally get away from things outside your control - you can't do anything about them so get them out of your mind.Warren wrote:Shooting under pressure is what magnifies weakness in a shooting technique.
If you think top shooters don't get nervous, think again. They have in many cases developed a technique that does not rely on being calm, that works under the WORST of conditions.
Okay, you can go the forced-relaxation route, and if you're very lucky you may get some success from it. I could calm myself quite successfully, right up until the first "START".
You can only conccentrate on one thing at a time so got through your shot process on the line - like you do in training and focus on what you need to do to produce a perfect shot. Concentrate on the job at hand not the outside influences. Some people will use distraction techniques - I remember that worked for me in my first finals. I chatted to some of the others on the line, people I know well and that took my mind away from what was about to ocurr. I then tried extremely hard to concentrate on the shot and not think about the environment and the circumstances. For me that worked well and I came off the line holding my starting position and very happy with a good finals score.
Rob.
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David Levene
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I couldn't agree more Warren. In fact, many top shooters need the adrenalin and elevated pulse rate to shoot well.Warren wrote:If you think top shooters don't get nervous, think again. They have in many cases developed a technique that does not rely on being calm, that works under the WORST of conditions.
The level at which the nerves kick in does however vary from one shooter to another and, for any individual shooter, from one stage of their shooting development to another.
It would be an extremely rare animal however who, faced with all of the hullabaloo (TV cameras, full spectator areas etc) of an Olympic, World or Continental Championship, didn't feel nervous. Planning for those nerves and having a robust technique that allows for them are the keys to shooting well.
Sorry to be the bearer of bad tidings, but I know a bunch of world class shooters who accept their elevated excitement level and use a technique that allows them to maintain a level of performance that will carry them through a Final without becoming a train wreck. Not ALL shooters are badly affected by nerves, but I saw a LOT of respected names puffing away on fags outside the hall at the Munich airgun matches, and I'm sorry, but I know they weren't doing so for their health. They do get nerves, they know how it will affect them, and they play the game accordingly. The higher the level they attain, the higher the potential stress level.RobStubbs wrote:
With respect, I have to disagree. What distinguishes good shooters from others is their ability to control their nerves not the fact that they shoot through them.
My main point here is to save you guys a lot of time and grief by learning from other peoples' mistakes. Develop a technique that relies on being calm and you will progress far slower than somebody who prepares for the worst of conditions. I'm talking competition scores here.
BTW, check out Mick Gault's most valuable practice drill on his interview page. Here's a guy who will run around the block to increase his heart rate before shooting to make training more like a big match.
Warren,
Micks interview is many years old - he doesn't do that any more and hasn't done for years.
Shooters do experience nerves but like I said they control those symptoms when it matters on the firing line. That is what you need to do and that is what my point was. Sure they get anxious and their heart rate goes up with the adrenalin. But it is controlled and one that the top shooters train for - predominantly through mental exercises.
If you read Lanny Basshams book as an example he discusses this very subject in detail. The way he and many other top shooters overcame their nerves was to practice, and rehearse the scenarios.
So whilst I agree with you in that shooting only when calm is a poor strategy what you as a shooter need is to be able to control the anxiety when it arises.
<edit>
I'm not sure this helps explain my thoughts but I know one guy who bricks himself every single final he does. The result, he almost always shoots a mediocre or poor final. The reason he under performs is because of his (so far) inability to control his nerves. Or perhaps I should say bring his anxiety levels down to manageable levels whereby they don't negatively affect his shooting.
My point is the 'solution' is to mentally manage your anxiety levels. I would say that if you can't do that you will probably never realise your full competitve potential.
Rob.
Micks interview is many years old - he doesn't do that any more and hasn't done for years.
Shooters do experience nerves but like I said they control those symptoms when it matters on the firing line. That is what you need to do and that is what my point was. Sure they get anxious and their heart rate goes up with the adrenalin. But it is controlled and one that the top shooters train for - predominantly through mental exercises.
If you read Lanny Basshams book as an example he discusses this very subject in detail. The way he and many other top shooters overcame their nerves was to practice, and rehearse the scenarios.
So whilst I agree with you in that shooting only when calm is a poor strategy what you as a shooter need is to be able to control the anxiety when it arises.
<edit>
I'm not sure this helps explain my thoughts but I know one guy who bricks himself every single final he does. The result, he almost always shoots a mediocre or poor final. The reason he under performs is because of his (so far) inability to control his nerves. Or perhaps I should say bring his anxiety levels down to manageable levels whereby they don't negatively affect his shooting.
My point is the 'solution' is to mentally manage your anxiety levels. I would say that if you can't do that you will probably never realise your full competitve potential.
Rob.
it's both!
Warren and Rob, I think you are both right, it isn't one or the other, it is both!
A top shooter needs to develop strategies for calming nerves, but also needs to refine their technique so it will work under even the worst of conditions.
Personally, I feel the more finals I've shot in, the better my ability to calm my nerves, because I am saying to myself, "hey, I've been here before, it's no biggy, I can do this!" But at the same time, the more perfect practice I've had, the better my technique is, the more confident I am going to be during the finals. And of course when my technique works well in the finals, and I am able to perform at a level I am happy with, then my nerves also calm down. They are very much related.
A top shooter needs to develop strategies for calming nerves, but also needs to refine their technique so it will work under even the worst of conditions.
Personally, I feel the more finals I've shot in, the better my ability to calm my nerves, because I am saying to myself, "hey, I've been here before, it's no biggy, I can do this!" But at the same time, the more perfect practice I've had, the better my technique is, the more confident I am going to be during the finals. And of course when my technique works well in the finals, and I am able to perform at a level I am happy with, then my nerves also calm down. They are very much related.
Trinity,
Cheers for that. I was just thinking Warren and I weren't really at great odds with each other, we were sorting of coming at the same thing from different angles. I do agree with what you say however and I guess I wasn't really putting myself across very well. My excuse is I've been stuck behind the desk at our range all night stickering a few hundred competition cards - and now it's bed time ;-).
Rob.
Cheers for that. I was just thinking Warren and I weren't really at great odds with each other, we were sorting of coming at the same thing from different angles. I do agree with what you say however and I guess I wasn't really putting myself across very well. My excuse is I've been stuck behind the desk at our range all night stickering a few hundred competition cards - and now it's bed time ;-).
Rob.
prep for finals
Getting the finals is an achievement and the is usually little between the qualification 1st and a few below, maybe even 8th.
Doing finals really helps and the more you do the better they become. Mental training is important to prep in the minds eye what is ahead as is a strategy for the 10 shots. Keeping focus and calm has to be important as is the training with friends with them as a natural progression. Even the pony club (junior air pistol) shoot finals after the qualification stage they also have tie shoots (even when the are no actual ties-David L is a master of this LOL) so they are used to finals and "one on one scraps". Result too soon to tell but training in finals can not do harm. The 15 to 18 year olds look forwards to them.
Sorry if post looks odd, I am in Italy at moment and using a Blackberry!
Doing finals really helps and the more you do the better they become. Mental training is important to prep in the minds eye what is ahead as is a strategy for the 10 shots. Keeping focus and calm has to be important as is the training with friends with them as a natural progression. Even the pony club (junior air pistol) shoot finals after the qualification stage they also have tie shoots (even when the are no actual ties-David L is a master of this LOL) so they are used to finals and "one on one scraps". Result too soon to tell but training in finals can not do harm. The 15 to 18 year olds look forwards to them.
Sorry if post looks odd, I am in Italy at moment and using a Blackberry!
prep for finals
Getting the finals is an achievement and the is usually little between the qualification 1st and a few below, maybe even 8th.
Doing finals really helps and the more you do the better they become. Mental training is important to prep in the minds eye what is ahead as is a strategy for the 10 shots. Keeping focus and calm has to be important as is the training with friends with them as a natural progression. Even the pony club (junior air pistol) shoot finals after the qualification stage they also have tie shoots (even when the are no actual ties-David L is a master of this LOL) so they are used to finals and "one on one scraps". Result too soon to tell but training in finals can not do harm. The 15 to 18 year olds look forwards to them.
Sorry if post looks odd, I am in Italy at moment and using a Blackberry!
Doing finals really helps and the more you do the better they become. Mental training is important to prep in the minds eye what is ahead as is a strategy for the 10 shots. Keeping focus and calm has to be important as is the training with friends with them as a natural progression. Even the pony club (junior air pistol) shoot finals after the qualification stage they also have tie shoots (even when the are no actual ties-David L is a master of this LOL) so they are used to finals and "one on one scraps". Result too soon to tell but training in finals can not do harm. The 15 to 18 year olds look forwards to them.
Sorry if post looks odd, I am in Italy at moment and using a Blackberry!
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F. Paul in Denver
With one exception, I think preparing for finals any differently than you prepare for the match that precedes it is, at the very least counter productive and maybe a recipe for disaster.
If the problem going into finals is stress, it seems to me that employing some sort of "special" preparation program would only serve to reinforce and remind a competitor of the stress (i.e. the stakes are higher, the competition tougher etc etc.). In other words, the solution may serve only to create greater awareness of the cause of the stress which in turn creates greater stress.
I think the more productive approach might be to treat every match in the same way. If you have developed relaxation techniques or any other methodology to remain cool, it should be employed consistently and for ANY & EVERY match and finals.
That way, when finals time rolls around, it's like sliding into a familiar pair of comfortable old shoes instead of those tight, painful dress shoes you only wear with your tuxedo once a year.
On the other hand, if you did nothing special to prep for the match in which you made it to the finals - stick to what works since it was good enough to get you to finals. When you feel the nerves coming on, tell yourself you that if you were good enough to get this far, there is nothing to stop you from going further. It's the same target at the same distance with the same gun being fired by the same gifted competitor.
The one exception I noted earlier is that I think it's important to do some training for finals. One minute to fire one round can be a problem if you are accustomed to using lots of time during the match. In finals, if you abort a shot once, you're likely to feel significant pressure to get the shot off on the very next raise or risk running out of time.
I like to end each practice session self visualizing myself in the finals and work on developing the cadence needed to accommodate the time element involved. Once again, I think we feel more comfortable in places we have been before (even if just in our own minds) rather than some place new.
Heck, maybe next week, I'll play a recording of people cheering and clapping when I shoot a 10 or better just to make training even more realistic. :-)
F. Paul in Denver
If the problem going into finals is stress, it seems to me that employing some sort of "special" preparation program would only serve to reinforce and remind a competitor of the stress (i.e. the stakes are higher, the competition tougher etc etc.). In other words, the solution may serve only to create greater awareness of the cause of the stress which in turn creates greater stress.
I think the more productive approach might be to treat every match in the same way. If you have developed relaxation techniques or any other methodology to remain cool, it should be employed consistently and for ANY & EVERY match and finals.
That way, when finals time rolls around, it's like sliding into a familiar pair of comfortable old shoes instead of those tight, painful dress shoes you only wear with your tuxedo once a year.
On the other hand, if you did nothing special to prep for the match in which you made it to the finals - stick to what works since it was good enough to get you to finals. When you feel the nerves coming on, tell yourself you that if you were good enough to get this far, there is nothing to stop you from going further. It's the same target at the same distance with the same gun being fired by the same gifted competitor.
The one exception I noted earlier is that I think it's important to do some training for finals. One minute to fire one round can be a problem if you are accustomed to using lots of time during the match. In finals, if you abort a shot once, you're likely to feel significant pressure to get the shot off on the very next raise or risk running out of time.
I like to end each practice session self visualizing myself in the finals and work on developing the cadence needed to accommodate the time element involved. Once again, I think we feel more comfortable in places we have been before (even if just in our own minds) rather than some place new.
Heck, maybe next week, I'll play a recording of people cheering and clapping when I shoot a 10 or better just to make training even more realistic. :-)
F. Paul in Denver
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Patrick Haynes
Finals Training
I think that you have to prep for Finals, same way that you have to prep for sighters, 1st record shot, last record shot, and everything in between. Different people have different things that set them off. I currently have an athlete who kicks butt in the finals, but has reduced performance in her match. Obviously, she shoots her match well enough to make it into the top 8, but she always out performs in the finals.
Well, I had her start shooting all of her 40 match shots with a stopwatch counting down from 75s. She stopped overholding. She became more determined to shoot. End result? Broke a 5 year drought by coming back with 2 bronze medals this summer.
Talking with David Moore, part of his Finals training includes delivering a passing shot in free pistol, simulating running out of time after two aborts. He knows that he can deliver a good shot simply by raising his pistol and shooting in very constrained time limits. This allows him to shoot his Finals with greater confidence.
We're testing out training with heart rate monitors, and the data is surprising. Two athletes, friends, shot Finals, and came within .1 points of each other. To be a jerk (yes, its a coach's job), I informed them that they had a shoot off. Heart rate in one athlete jumped about 20 BPM, and she still shot a 10.8! If Finals or shoot-offs seem different, then you have to train for them differently. Yes, try to normalise the differences and match each shot identical, but the reality is that an athlete will usually perceive a difference.
What am I saying? Set your training up to prepare you for your match. If you experience anxiety in Finals, first, learn how to lower that anxiety, but also build stress into your training, so you can learn to perform under those conditions. Observe match behaviour and training behaviour. Learn how to bring those two closer together, so you can perform equally well in both. By looking at one athlete's Finals, we came up with a strategy to improve her match performance. By looking at another athlete's HR, we found that she wasn't as cool and calm INSIDE as we thought, despite impressive performances.
Just some thoughts.
Patrick
http://www.targetshooting.ca
Well, I had her start shooting all of her 40 match shots with a stopwatch counting down from 75s. She stopped overholding. She became more determined to shoot. End result? Broke a 5 year drought by coming back with 2 bronze medals this summer.
Talking with David Moore, part of his Finals training includes delivering a passing shot in free pistol, simulating running out of time after two aborts. He knows that he can deliver a good shot simply by raising his pistol and shooting in very constrained time limits. This allows him to shoot his Finals with greater confidence.
We're testing out training with heart rate monitors, and the data is surprising. Two athletes, friends, shot Finals, and came within .1 points of each other. To be a jerk (yes, its a coach's job), I informed them that they had a shoot off. Heart rate in one athlete jumped about 20 BPM, and she still shot a 10.8! If Finals or shoot-offs seem different, then you have to train for them differently. Yes, try to normalise the differences and match each shot identical, but the reality is that an athlete will usually perceive a difference.
What am I saying? Set your training up to prepare you for your match. If you experience anxiety in Finals, first, learn how to lower that anxiety, but also build stress into your training, so you can learn to perform under those conditions. Observe match behaviour and training behaviour. Learn how to bring those two closer together, so you can perform equally well in both. By looking at one athlete's Finals, we came up with a strategy to improve her match performance. By looking at another athlete's HR, we found that she wasn't as cool and calm INSIDE as we thought, despite impressive performances.
Just some thoughts.
Patrick
http://www.targetshooting.ca