"20 minutes coaching..." :Excellent post - will try out this advice tonight at my club, where, incidently, there are no pistol coaches. That means I am relying on you guys! The first internet pistol coaching site?
I have a preamble, then a question, then, I guess, a 'postamble' (whatever the opposite of a preamble is?).
I know when I have fouled up on my trigger.
I can call a good shot (i.e. when the whole process is silky smooth and subconscious).
BUT how do I know my trigger finger is in the right place on the trigger?
Presumably if I am getting the release wrong sometimes (and its not always mental - its often physical) my finger may be in the wrong place.
As a beginer I figured the best thing to do is get a good, but cheap, second hand pistol and take it from there. Step up Walther CPM-1. The handle is just about the right size (maybe a smidgeon too small). However I have big hands (I think - 10cm across the knuckles and a 22cm open hand span) and I am not sure where my trigger finger should be. I have tried finger-tip (1st phalange) on the trigger, but the 'natural' position is the second phalange. Which bit of the finger is right (if there is a right) and how do I adjust the trigger length and angle to make sure my finger is in the right place?
Advice?
Apropos "20 minutes coaching" - trigger position
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David Levene
- Posts: 5617
- Joined: Mon Mar 01, 2004 12:49 pm
- Location: Ruislip, UK
The traditional point for positioning the finger on the trigger is approcimately 1/3 of the way into the top pad from the end of the finger.
It is extremely important that, at the point of trigger release, you are pulling straight back on the trigger. This would normally mean that the finger is lying straight across the trigger, at 90 degrees to the barrel line.
I don't know the CPM-1 but, in general, one of the things that you get with the more expensive guns is adjustability.
It is extremely important that, at the point of trigger release, you are pulling straight back on the trigger. This would normally mean that the finger is lying straight across the trigger, at 90 degrees to the barrel line.
I don't know the CPM-1 but, in general, one of the things that you get with the more expensive guns is adjustability.
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Fred Mannis
- Posts: 1298
- Joined: Sun Aug 29, 2004 8:37 pm
- Location: Delaware
Grip Putty
David has good advice (as always).
If you still can't obtain the natural position David describes by moving the trigger forward, then you might consider using grip putty to build up the grip. Or buying a larger grip for your Walther.
If you still can't obtain the natural position David describes by moving the trigger forward, then you might consider using grip putty to build up the grip. Or buying a larger grip for your Walther.
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Steve Swartz
1) Your grip position, body position, and position of finger on trigger are all related. Oh No!
2) Work from the feet upwards. Establsih "empty hand" natural point of aim (described in other posts) Then grip gun (finger out of trigger guard) so that when checking natural point of aim, sights appear generally aligned and pointed at the aiming area. Fool around with this until you get a comfortable body position (stance) and grip.
3) Now let your trigger finger fall "naturally" inside the trigger guard. If your finger rests comfortably so that previous advice re 90 degree angle, center to last third of pad, middle of trigger, etc. is met, fine. If not, adjust trigger position so that it will be.
4) Dry fire while focusing on alignment against a blank background. If the front sight moves, move your finger position on the trigger in the same direction of the sight movement. Only after the front sight movement appears "neutralized," begin concentrating on applying pressure as "stright back" (parallel to centerline of bore) as you can; note any changes to front sight alignment and adjust.
5) Repeat the above exercise EVERY SINGLE TIME before starting any training session. Do this entire exercise until you are able to walk up, address the target, and dry fire ten times perfectly. You will find initially yoiu may get slight variations in stance, grip, and finger position; however, with repectition you will find the variations go away and you will have just developed some critical aspects of your technique.
Steve Swartz
2) Work from the feet upwards. Establsih "empty hand" natural point of aim (described in other posts) Then grip gun (finger out of trigger guard) so that when checking natural point of aim, sights appear generally aligned and pointed at the aiming area. Fool around with this until you get a comfortable body position (stance) and grip.
3) Now let your trigger finger fall "naturally" inside the trigger guard. If your finger rests comfortably so that previous advice re 90 degree angle, center to last third of pad, middle of trigger, etc. is met, fine. If not, adjust trigger position so that it will be.
4) Dry fire while focusing on alignment against a blank background. If the front sight moves, move your finger position on the trigger in the same direction of the sight movement. Only after the front sight movement appears "neutralized," begin concentrating on applying pressure as "stright back" (parallel to centerline of bore) as you can; note any changes to front sight alignment and adjust.
5) Repeat the above exercise EVERY SINGLE TIME before starting any training session. Do this entire exercise until you are able to walk up, address the target, and dry fire ten times perfectly. You will find initially yoiu may get slight variations in stance, grip, and finger position; however, with repectition you will find the variations go away and you will have just developed some critical aspects of your technique.
Steve Swartz
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Steve Swartz
Oops sorry move your finger on the trigger in the OPPOSITE direction if you are shooting a mechanical trigger.
Thought experiment: Your finger is way too "right" on the trigger. Therefore, you are "pushing" the muzzle to the left.
Of course, right before the shot breaks you are applying rightward wrist pressure to compensate. At the instant of shot release, the trigger pressure (to the left) is reduced considerably- and the front sight will "snap" or "jerk" to the right- your compensating wrist pressure doesn't instantaneously drop as the trigger pressure would.
You will see the front sight jerk to the right- the solution is to move your finger to the left (reducing the right-left side pressure).
On an electromechanical trigger, you will only see the sideways pressure push the front sight in the same direction as the second stage engages. This will be observed *before* the shot break. With electromechanicals, it's less of an issue but you should "Skooch" your finger in the same direction as the apparent alignment shift.
Steve Swartz
p.s. and we haven't discussed shoulder rotation yet . . . or the effects of toe-in vs. toe-out . . . but follow the "Natural Point of Aim" process described earlier and you will certainly be in the ballpark.
Steve Swartz
Thought experiment: Your finger is way too "right" on the trigger. Therefore, you are "pushing" the muzzle to the left.
Of course, right before the shot breaks you are applying rightward wrist pressure to compensate. At the instant of shot release, the trigger pressure (to the left) is reduced considerably- and the front sight will "snap" or "jerk" to the right- your compensating wrist pressure doesn't instantaneously drop as the trigger pressure would.
You will see the front sight jerk to the right- the solution is to move your finger to the left (reducing the right-left side pressure).
On an electromechanical trigger, you will only see the sideways pressure push the front sight in the same direction as the second stage engages. This will be observed *before* the shot break. With electromechanicals, it's less of an issue but you should "Skooch" your finger in the same direction as the apparent alignment shift.
Steve Swartz
p.s. and we haven't discussed shoulder rotation yet . . . or the effects of toe-in vs. toe-out . . . but follow the "Natural Point of Aim" process described earlier and you will certainly be in the ballpark.
Steve Swartz
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Fred Mannis
- Posts: 1298
- Joined: Sun Aug 29, 2004 8:37 pm
- Location: Delaware
The Book
Steve,
When are you going to write that book?
Fred
When are you going to write that book?
Fred
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bluechucky
- Posts: 39
- Joined: Sat Feb 05, 2005 9:13 am
- Location: Victoria, Australia
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Steve Swartz
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bluechucky
- Posts: 39
- Joined: Sat Feb 05, 2005 9:13 am
- Location: Victoria, Australia