Procedure for Conducting a Rapid Fire pistol Match?

[PETE S]

Has anyone held match with multiple entries used this procedure?
Could you give me a description of how you organized the shooters on the line and ran the event. How did you call the commands? Only one shooter can fire at a time but I assume you could have multiple shooters ready and go down the line.

Per USAS GTR rules:

USA
6.3.17B
In USA Shooting sanctioned PTO’s for all 25m events an acoustic shot timer with audible start and stop signals on a fixed target array may be used if turning or electronic scoring targetsare not used/available. Any shots fired before the start signal or after the stop signal (plus a built-in 1/10thsecond buffer) will be scored as misses. The timer must be capable of being set to 8, 6 and 4 seconds. Only one shooter should fire at a time to prevent shots from surrounding shooters from causing a false reading. National Records may not be set using this method. This method may not be used for team selection

[RobStubbs]

Sounds hellishly complicated to shoot one at a time. I would opt for shooting 'to the spirit of the rules' and having multiple shooters on the line at the same time. If your really concerned then have a range officer watching each shooter. If you did one shooter at a time, with scoring you'd be talking about a 4 hour competition. I guess that may be an over-exaggeration if you did it as a relay 'down the line'

Rob.

[PETE S]

I think your impression maybe a little complicated but that is what I am trying to learn.

The range I have available is one of the better in the area. Outdoors with covered firing points, concrete floor, mowed grass and room for 27 Bullseye shooters with turning targets at 25 yards. Spacing is in correct between the targets for international (ISSF) rapid fire pistol. Not much change of changing the range as the target frames are in concrete foundations.

I can make target frames to have the correct distances, adjusted to the 25 yard firing distance, but they would not be turning targets. The least expensive approach is to use the shot timers made popular in ISPC and cowboy action events.

How people have run the event so as not to be a four hour event is my question. I have some thoughts but want to here actual experience.

[R.M.]

Like Rob says, "In the spirit of the rules". I don't think you're planning anything more than "A Match", and I commend you for it. Wish more people would take the bull by the horns.
Something you could try, is making a frame for 4 targets, and using one of the bullseye targets for the 5th. This way you have a turning target to eliminate skidders and late shots. This will only work if you have the rapidfire times on the bullseye targets.

R.M.

[Ted Bell]

Pete-
Where are you located at? Might be able to get some local help from folks on this list if they happen to be nearby.

-Ted

[sparky]

I think having one shooter shoot at a time is pretty easy.
Have them all finish their prep. Have them all load. All shooters stand easy while Shooter 1 shoots. The timer/range officer moves to Shooter 2; all shooters stand easy while Shooter 2 shoots. The timer/range officer moves to Shooter 3...

Does this deviate a little from the rules? Maybe a little, but not in a significant manner. The slight, meaningless deviation more than offset by the ability to have more shooters shoot at a time. Run as suggested above, each string of three shooters from the time the first shooter fires his first shot to the last shooter fires his last shot should take no longer than 1 minute. With actual shooting time taking 6 minutes or less, it shouldn't be difficult to run three shooters through a 30 shot course in 30 minutes or less, assuming you don't score until after the course is completed.

[Mike McDaniel]

I think Sparky's right. If you can set up several target bays, you can have all shooters load, then have each one shoot in succession. Then go forward and score.

[PETE S]

Thank you for the responses. I think I will try this rapid fire procedure at a PTO. I have to research the shot timers a bit and biuld some traget frames.

My plan would be to have three, four or Five competitors on the line. Give the command to load the magazines with five rounds but not insert the magazines until the RO/timer is to their firing point and it is time for them to fire. Give the shooter a chance to insert the magazine and make final preps, then start the count down.

My question still remains, Has anyone ever used the shot timer for conducting a ISSF rapid fire match?

[sparky]

I've only used one for practices. No problems. I've used them extensively in IPSC matches. No problems. Any particular worries you have in mind?

[PETE S]

I have never worked with one and there are a couple of requirements as listed in the original post. Price seems to vary from about $75 to almost $200.

Which would you reccomend?

[Ted Bell]

I have never worked with one and there are a couple of requirements as listed in the original post. Price seems to vary from about $75 to almost $200.

Which would you reccomend?

They will all do what you need them to for conducting a RF match, so if $$ is a major concern, buy the least expensive of the bunch. The primary difference between all of the ones out there is a) what else will they do (for example can you program it to give you audible beeps at specific times or intervals, kind of like a metronome; how many different calculations will it perform with your data) and b) the display, specifically, how many different things are displayed at the same time and how tedious or easy is it to cycle through all of the information. However, even one which is considered to be more difficult/tedious is still really not hard- might be two or three key presses, but once you know what they are, it's hardly "difficult."

Re: what else they do, the usual "option" is a chronograph, like with the PACT Mark IV (the one I have). If you handload and/or shoot other disciplines, the chronograph can be very useful. It's also useful for making sure whatever ammo you're shooting is above the minimum velocity requirements.

Another difference is whether they have some sort of output jack that you can use to trigger lights, turning targets, etc. I have the Mark IV, and use the signal output to turn on a Gralab darkroom timer. (I have the Gralab wired up to turn on green lights on the target when it starts counting down, and switches the green lights off and red lights on when it hits zero. The reason I use the PACT to turn it on is to use the PACT's random countdown feature. That way I don't know for sure when the green lights are going to come on, and it allows me to better simulate match conditions when I'm practicing alone.)

If money is a concern, you won't go wrong buying the least expensive timer (pocket pro, or the PACT Club timer). If it is within your budget, I'd go with the Mark IV- the different things it can do is pretty amazing, and you'll never outgrow it.

-Ted