free pistol ammunition

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Thu Jan 06, 2005 12:55 pm

Will high velocity ammuntion damage a Free Pistol?

rick983 · Post by **rick983** » Thu Jan 06, 2005 6:30 pm

I'm certainly no expert on these matters but I would think these guns are precisely designed for ammunition within a very specific chamber pressure range and I'm sure the high velocity ammo will not be nearly as accurate as decent match ammo specifically designed for these type of pistols. Would you put 87 octane unleaded in your new Ferrari? No way!

fsmte · Post by **fsmte** » Thu Jan 06, 2005 7:37 pm

Hello
manual of Hammerli 150, 160, and 162 says clearly that NOT if must use the ammunition high velocity. can damage the firing pin and chamber.

kleefurd · Post by **kleefurd** » Thu Jan 06, 2005 8:31 pm

I remember an incident when our munitions expert in the army took one crate of 5.56 NATO ammo packed with additional grains, and adding some "magic powder" making them fire at a higher velocity and asked us to shoot 1,500 rounds with this new ammo on the M16A2 and what we found was there was a significant wear and tear on (mainly) the barrel and chamber (bolt carrier wear was much higher too, looked as if we shot 10,000 rounds on auto through them!)

I believe this translates to higher wear on any other arms. But I might be wrong, but just sharing my experience with assault rifles (I served 15 years in the infantry). I am new to ISSF shooting but the fundamentals to firearms should be similar. If a hardy M16A2 can show significant wear after 1,000 rounds, I cannot imagine what it will do to a precision pistol.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Thu Jan 06, 2005 9:55 pm

fsmte wrote:... high velocity. can damage the firing pin and chamber.

Does anyone know how, in what way, the chamber and pin can be damaged? As I see it, the increase in chamber pressure for .22LR high velocity is almost negligible. The pin strikes and is then passive, so how can it be affected when the bolt or falling block is restraining the cartridge?

RobStubbs · Post by **RobStubbs** » Fri Jan 07, 2005 3:18 am

Anonymous wrote:Does anyone know how, in what way, the chamber and pin can be damaged? As I see it, the increase in chamber pressure for .22LR high velocity is almost negligible. The pin strikes and is then passive, so how can it be affected when the bolt or falling block is restraining the cartridge?

I would suggest if the manufacturers say don't use it then it would be wise to heed their advice. You would invalidate any form of warranty should the gun get damaged plus I don't see why you would want to use high velocity ammo.

Rob.

sparky · Post by **sparky** » Fri Jan 07, 2005 3:55 am

I don't see how it would do any harm, but you might not get good groups. All of the free pistols I've seen were of some sort of single-shot, locked breech design, so there are no worries about increased wear due parts moving at higher than designed velocities (as might be found in an M-16). All of the designs I've seen in free pistols look fairly stout, so I don't think the negligible difference in pressure would matter. FWIW, I've used high velocity ammo (Federal Lightning, and whatever else I could afford at the time) in several Tozs and a Hammerli 162 without any problems.
I would be much more cautious of shooting high velocity ammo in a semi-auto.

DISCLAIMER: For entertainment purposes only. If you blow your gun up, it's not my fault.

kleefurd · Post by **kleefurd** » Fri Jan 07, 2005 4:37 am

sparky wrote:I don't see how it would do any harm, but you might not get good groups. All of the free pistols I've seen were of some sort of single-shot, locked breech design, so there are no worries about increased wear due parts moving at higher than designed velocities (as might be found in an M-16). All of the designs I've seen in free pistols look fairly stout, so I don't think the negligible difference in pressure would matter. FWIW, I've used high velocity ammo (Federal Lightning, and whatever else I could afford at the time) in several Tozs and a Hammerli 162 without any problems.
I would be much more cautious of shooting high velocity ammo in a semi-auto.

DISCLAIMER: For entertainment purposes only. If you blow your gun up, it's not my fault.

True about the not having to worry about chamber wear on a precision pistols but barrel wear would be a concern nevertheless... but as you have mentioned... if its merely for self-entertainment purposes and if you are trying out high velocity ammo for the fun of it (satisfying your curiousity) and on older (or spare) pistols, well... it would not really matter does it? Have fun and experiment by all means.

ruig · Post by **ruig** » Fri Jan 07, 2005 4:58 am

Anonymous wrote:Will high velocity ammuntion damage a Free Pistol?

Here I shoot FP with domestically produced "SPORT OKHOTA" (or in exact translation "SPORT HUNTING"). Whole black cartridge, steel case. When I started to use that ammo I was shocked - it's real stronger, than others. I suppose that this cartridge was made for hunting at for small animals.
BUT pistol works fine... no tech. problems... excluding strong recoil and firing pin replacement (previous one couldn't pick steel shell).

fsmte · Post by **fsmte** » Fri Jan 07, 2005 7:11 am

Anonymous wrote:
fsmte wrote:... high velocity. can damage the firing pin and chamber.
Does anyone know how, in what way, the chamber and pin can be damaged? As I see it, the increase in chamber pressure for .22LR high velocity is almost negligible. The pin strikes and is then passive, so how can it be affected when the bolt or falling block is restraining the cartridge?

who informed me that the firing pin and the chamber would suffer very, was in WC Munich 2003, in stand of the proper plant of the Hämmerli. I asked therefore the manual said not to use and I wanted to know what I could damage. the explanation is that the consuming would be bigger.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Fri Jan 07, 2005 9:11 am

Why use high velocity ammunition in the first place.
The ISSF 50m 25mm X-ring is a challenge but the rubber electronic or paper targets put up little resistance. I am note interested in accuracy.
Is this for a falling plate competition?

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Fri Jan 07, 2005 9:51 am

fsmte wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
fsmte wrote:...
who informed me that the firing pin and the chamber would suffer very, was in WC Munich 2003, in stand of the proper plant of the Hämmerli. I asked therefore the manual said not to use and I wanted to know what I could damage. the explanation is that the consuming would be bigger.

It would take many tens of thousands of lead rounds to wear a barrel. The falling block pivot pin would have more stress, but enough to cause damage? Just speculating here, but I suspect Hammerli doesn't want high velocity rounds used because of the larger groups it would make. The unreliability of 'plinker' ammunition might also be a factor. Both could have an effect on the reputation of the Hammerli product.

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