Butthook question 50m smallbore

[Rtbilly]

Hello
I have a question I was hoping someone could clarify. Is it permissible for me to attach balance weights to the hook of my butt plate?
The ISSF rules state "weights cannot extend further to the rear than a line perpendicular to the deepest point in the butt plate."
I'm not sure I'm clearly understanding what that means but it sounds like putting weights on the hook itself wouldnt be allowed. Is that correct?
I'd like to add weight to the rear of my 2007/2013 wooden anschutz stock. I used some parts gathered up which allow me to mock up a hook with which I'm able to slide weights onto. Would this be breaking the rules? Any advice or suggestions as to how to add some weight legally would be appreciated. Thank you

[spektr]

You DO know that the rulebook seems to be silent on making hook parts out of tungsten.............. It seems to me that if the hook itself weighed enough, the weight definition and location would vanish......

[Rtbilly]

Tungsten ha that's humorous! Thanks for the laugh however still would appreciate any useable advice

[lyoke2]

What buttplate are you using? Are you sliding weights around the hook? How are the staying in place?

Could you do a mock-up or drawing?

I am interested by the concept.

[Rtbilly]

Hi yes. So I should clarify why I'm doing this. I purchased a used rifle which has a buttplate minus the hook. I'm a bit on the smaller size so the original butt plate assembly is just a bit too big. I really wanted to try to hobble something together so I dont need to shell out a lot of money on a new hook assembly.
I took the butt plate off my hammerli ar50 air rifle (basic Centra MEC) and attached it to the anschutz carrier. However my hammerli ar50 air rifle also was supplied with a balance weight rod that attached to its aluminum stock under the butt plate. I looked at and thought if flipped around and installed on the anschutz it resembled a hook...and since it was already designed as a weight carrier I just thought I'd keep the weights on it. I could try to take a photo and upload it but I've tried uploading pictures before w/o success.

[Rtbilly]

Took a photo and tried to upload but got an error that says file is too large. Sorry.
To describe it better the weights are circular and slide onto the rod being secured in place via screws tapped through the weight and tightened to the rod.
If you google a hammerli ar50 image you'll probably see a silver weight extension under the butt plate which has 3 small circular weights slid onto it. I just find it to balance well.
Hope that description helps

[lyoke2]

So it would be turning the weight balance in the picture below into a hook?

https://imgbbb.com/image/TEc2VO

[Rtbilly]

Yes thank you for sharing. That's exactly what I did. For me it seems to work but not sure if it fits the rules?

[lyoke2]

This is kind of a grey area....

When you look at 7.4.5.C the weights cannot go back past the perpendicular line to the buttplate.

But if the buttplate comforms to 7.4.5.1 and the weights are technically the hook... it would meet 7.4.5.1.E?

I am going to reach out to someone on this one and get another opinion.

[Tim S]

Yes thank you for sharing. That's exactly what I did. For me it seems to work but not sure if it fits the rules?

Rules not withstanding, those weights look like they would get in the way. Practically speaking you don't want that.

[Rtbilly]

Thank you for helping find an answer.
At first I too thought the weights would get in the way however to be truthful I dont notice them. To me, they really dont feel much wider than an old thicker hook.

[spektr]

This is kind of a grey area....

When you look at 7.4.5.C the weights cannot go back past the perpendicular line to the buttplate.

But if the buttplate comforms to 7.4.5.1 and the weights are technically the hook... it would meet 7.4.5.1.E?

I am going to reach out to someone on this one and get another opinion.

And wben one has a lathe, tungsten Parts start looking very interesting .....

[Modena]

In this example attached pic the green is a weight, weights cannot go past the (imaginary) red line. This was explained to me by a senior ISSF equipment control official when I had a weight go a few mm past this line.

[Rtbilly]

Thank you. That helps me visualize what the rule is and I guess I would definitely be in violation. I appreciate all who shared their time and knowledge. Probably should stop tinkering and just place an order. Although the tungsten and lathe route does sound interesting! However not sure if my leg is being pulled? Thanks to all

[lyoke2]

I don't believe your leg is being pulled.

The diagram provided makes sense for where the weights are mounted and what the rules state. A weighted hook is still in question. If it is made of the heavier material (i.e. tungsten for this example) I don't think it would be questioned. Attached weight to the hook is most likely against the rules.

[spektr]

Just took a look....
McMaster Carr has 3/8 inch tungsten rod for $113 a foot.
Its C25 so its not too terribly hard....
Interestingly they have pre-notched 3/8 rod in 2.5, 3 and 4 inch lengths.
$36 to $60 per segment
Drill \ Tap one side, drill and counterbore the other for a socket head 2-56 and your home.
SSOOOOO you can replicate the segmented hooks fairly easily.
Its days like this I hate being a Retired Tool Engineer........

And no I'm not pulling peoples legs, this looks easy peasy

[Tim S]

A Free Rifle butt would weight more than the MEC Contact, have a normal adjustment range, and legal. A cheaper option would be to remove the weights from the ersatz hook and put adhesive wheel weights elsewhere on the butt.

[Rtbilly]

That's really great information thank you! You must have all sorts of ideas and even better the skills to turn them into reality! Sure could use your skill as I am also trying to have weights made for my running target rifles. Ever get bored or feel the need to make something feel free to contact me. Thanks again!

[Modena]

I don't believe your leg is being pulled.

The diagram provided makes sense for where the weights are mounted and what the rules state. A weighted hook is still in question. If it is made of the heavier material (i.e. tungsten for this example) I don't think it would be questioned. Attached weight to the hook is most likely against the rules.

Agreed