My son is 16 and in 10th grade. This is his 2nd year is 10m 3p. He's been in the 270 range for most of this year with a PR of 278, but his scores have been degrading of late. He does fine in prone, but standing and kneeling have begun killing him and he claims he can't figure out why. He'll but bust 10s and 10xs out of the sighters rarely with any shot worse than 9, but when he moves to record fire its all down hill. His hold time goes up and score goes down. Everything points a mental issue, but I'm don't know how to help him fix it.
Any advise or links to articles would be greatly appreciated.
10m AR advise for a kid in a slump.
Moderators: pilkguns, Marcus, m1963
Re: 10m AR advise for a kid in a slup.
Well two thoughts
1) The mental aspect is probably because he is worried and counts the score as he shoots. Take a marker and black out the lines in the bull ... shoot for small group size. If you have an ORION you can score the target later if you want. Concentrate on the small group size (shoot 3-4 shots per bull) and then as a separate task get it centered. Also the scores you quote are 3x10 (I'm guessing 4-H?) ... you need to get him up to shooting at least 3x20 and referencing everything off of that ... the 3x10 score will follow. Hang a single 10 bull and have him pound it with those 3-4 shots per bull with the lines masked and you'll be surprised. Do that for a month before you let him see the lines again.
2) Hey kids grow ... the gals get off easy as they tend to stop growing about 17-18 maybe 19. Guys, probably not till 21 or 22. Their positions will necessarily have to change. It is not uncommon when I take a 9-10 year old shooter in at their beginning of the sport to have to rebuild their positions from scratch 4-5 times as they grow thru the teenage years. The thing to watch for is a plateau and then a decrease in the scores ... as well as your 'fridge going empty. I have my shooters parents let me know when they go thru the large eating sessions to help remind me to check their growth. We have a metal support beam in our range where everyone gets their height tagged every so often.
Sometimes the shooters will get really discouraged about the lack of progress, but if can attribute it to growth in a positive way, it becomes easier (never easy) to convince them to let you tear the position down and rebuild it.
Their arms and legs grow first ... that's why I call them spiders when they have to change the positions ... eventually their torso will catch up ... and you'll need to rebuild again around that.
1) The mental aspect is probably because he is worried and counts the score as he shoots. Take a marker and black out the lines in the bull ... shoot for small group size. If you have an ORION you can score the target later if you want. Concentrate on the small group size (shoot 3-4 shots per bull) and then as a separate task get it centered. Also the scores you quote are 3x10 (I'm guessing 4-H?) ... you need to get him up to shooting at least 3x20 and referencing everything off of that ... the 3x10 score will follow. Hang a single 10 bull and have him pound it with those 3-4 shots per bull with the lines masked and you'll be surprised. Do that for a month before you let him see the lines again.
2) Hey kids grow ... the gals get off easy as they tend to stop growing about 17-18 maybe 19. Guys, probably not till 21 or 22. Their positions will necessarily have to change. It is not uncommon when I take a 9-10 year old shooter in at their beginning of the sport to have to rebuild their positions from scratch 4-5 times as they grow thru the teenage years. The thing to watch for is a plateau and then a decrease in the scores ... as well as your 'fridge going empty. I have my shooters parents let me know when they go thru the large eating sessions to help remind me to check their growth. We have a metal support beam in our range where everyone gets their height tagged every so often.
Sometimes the shooters will get really discouraged about the lack of progress, but if can attribute it to growth in a positive way, it becomes easier (never easy) to convince them to let you tear the position down and rebuild it.
Their arms and legs grow first ... that's why I call them spiders when they have to change the positions ... eventually their torso will catch up ... and you'll need to rebuild again around that.
Re: 10m AR advise for a kid in a slump.
Thanks for the advise. He's shooting for the high school, 3x10 cof. We'll give some tips a workout at practice today.
Re: 10m AR advise for a kid in a slump.
I should have looked at your location ... I do recall the GAHS shoots 3x10.
No matter, the overtraining will still help him immensely.
Hiding those lines in the bull likewise. Take a fatty marker in today.
He'll grump, but it will help.
No matter, the overtraining will still help him immensely.
Hiding those lines in the bull likewise. Take a fatty marker in today.
He'll grump, but it will help.
Re: 10m AR advise for a kid in a slump.
Had him shooting 5m BB targets the other day. They have an aiming black about the size of a dime. He did really well, which led me to start checking his front aperture. He had the minimum in for his eye to front sight length. We went up on it by .3 mm anyway, and it lowered his hold time. Got one that came in last night that will increase it by .7mm. Sending him to CMP camp this summer.
Re: 10m AR advise for a kid in a slump.
What gun and aperture is he shooting?
We shoot 888s & 887s and I have most of our kids between a 3.9 and 4.2mm aperture.
We shoot 888s & 887s and I have most of our kids between a 3.9 and 4.2mm aperture.
Re: 10m AR advise for a kid in a slump.
Anschutz 8002 s2. He's got 33'' between his eye and the front sight, so we started with the minimum recommended 4.0. He's using a 4.3 now.
Re: 10m AR advise for a kid in a slump.
Yup 4.2-4.3 is good.
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redschietti
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Re: 10m AR advise for a kid in a slump.
Take spotting scope away.. Shoot groups blind
When he overholds tell him to put it down and encourage him to shoot it or put it down with in a certain number of seconds.. You have to time him to know what that time is
Build pressure drills into his training
Shoot finals.. 'Load' 'start' must shoot in 50s 30s
Sounds like hes in a program where they shoot a 3 by 10 every night... I dont like that at all
When he overholds tell him to put it down and encourage him to shoot it or put it down with in a certain number of seconds.. You have to time him to know what that time is
Build pressure drills into his training
Shoot finals.. 'Load' 'start' must shoot in 50s 30s
Sounds like hes in a program where they shoot a 3 by 10 every night... I dont like that at all
Re: 10m AR advise for a kid in a slump.
Things are looking up. Got him spending at least 30 sec with the gun on the stand between shots. We shot 3x20 in practice Saturday, and he finished both standing in like 9 mins and did about what he had been (low 80s). Had him hang another target and shoot a modified final. Including loading he was getting the shot off in about 20 to 30 sec, but I didn't call for the next shot until a full min had passed. He set an new PR on that target (94). Did the same thing in kneeling he shot just under his old PR. He shot a 273 in the match Tuesday and I could tell he had his confidence back. Now if I can just get him to do a better job journaling.
Re: 10m AR advise for a kid in a slump.
I normally don't ask my kids to see their journal ... I want them to feel free to write whatever.
SOMETIMES ... I'll tell them to write down what I think they should work on next practice.
i.e. "why don't you jot a note we need to work on 'X' next time and we'll go from there"
Sometimes my shooters will decide to "write it down when they get home, or figure that "remembering" will be OK. (Note: at home is not the place to keep a journal)
Next practice ask them to see what they wrote down ... if nothing, then they get to see the"STERN" me (they don't usually) ... I then tell them if they didn't think it was all that necessary, then they are not shooting that day and they can help me with some of the other shooters ... taking notes for me and jotting down where another shooter need help from their perspective ... helpful for them, helpful for me, helpful for the other shooter ... a "Win-Win" right? You can progress that to "well just sit and watch", or if their parents are there, "just go ahead and go".
Yes, over 11 years of this I have lost a few who did not take the hint and never came back, but even if "talented" how far are they really gonna progress and there is always someone willing to put in the extra that I can spend my time with.
Right now I have a new 9 year old that from DAY 2 is journaling while her brother (11) who started at the same time is not ... somebody's gonna get the treatment here soon.
SOMETIMES ... I'll tell them to write down what I think they should work on next practice.
i.e. "why don't you jot a note we need to work on 'X' next time and we'll go from there"
Sometimes my shooters will decide to "write it down when they get home, or figure that "remembering" will be OK. (Note: at home is not the place to keep a journal)
Next practice ask them to see what they wrote down ... if nothing, then they get to see the"STERN" me (they don't usually) ... I then tell them if they didn't think it was all that necessary, then they are not shooting that day and they can help me with some of the other shooters ... taking notes for me and jotting down where another shooter need help from their perspective ... helpful for them, helpful for me, helpful for the other shooter ... a "Win-Win" right? You can progress that to "well just sit and watch", or if their parents are there, "just go ahead and go".
Yes, over 11 years of this I have lost a few who did not take the hint and never came back, but even if "talented" how far are they really gonna progress and there is always someone willing to put in the extra that I can spend my time with.
Right now I have a new 9 year old that from DAY 2 is journaling while her brother (11) who started at the same time is not ... somebody's gonna get the treatment here soon.
Re: 10m AR advise for a kid in a slump.
what I did with my son who shot in High school MCJROTC I would watch him when he would drop in on the stock and he would close his eyes to make sure his NPA was on I would start the timer and stop it after each shot . then I would let him know what his time was. initially he was 14 to 20 sec to take the shot. He worked on it until he averages around 8 to 10 seconds and his scores went up dramatically. He finally got his average to 596 in his 3x20.