On the command "load"..

[conradin]

Can anyone give me a quick answer...when the command of load is given, does that mean:
1. putting rounds into the magazine, then put magazine into the pistol? or
2. rounds already are inside the magazine, so just put magazine into the pistol?

if 2, then does it mean: you can load 5 rounds into 12 different magazines for all the strings before the match even begins?

In the case of revolver, can you put all the rounds into 12 speed loaders first before the match even begins?

Also, if 2. can you load 10 rounds 10 round magazines so you can go through 2 strings? So when the first string is finished you merely drop the magazine off and wait for the command and pop it back in for the next string..or you do not even need to drop the magazine off but merely put the pistol down and open the breech and put a safety flag in...


I am a bit confused because watching ISSF video on RFP I sometimes see competitors already have 5 rounds inside the magazine..either they put the rounds in so quick that by the time the word "load" is barely finished the rounds are already in, or the rounds are already in the first place. So I can only see the competitor put his magazine inside the pistol.

[David Levene]

Can anyone give me a quick answer...when the command of load is given, does that mean:
1. putting rounds into the magazine, then put magazine into the pistol? or
2. rounds already are inside the magazine, so just put magazine into the pistol?

if 2, then does it mean: you can load 5 rounds into 12 different magazines for all the strings before the match even begins?

In the case of revolver, can you put all the rounds into 12 speed loaders first before the match even begins?

Also, if 2. can you load 10 rounds 10 round magazines so you can go through 2 strings? So when the first string is finished you merely drop the magazine off and wait for the command and pop it back in for the next string..or you do not even need to drop the magazine off but merely put the pistol down and open the breech and put a safety flag in...


I am a bit confused because watching ISSF video on RFP I sometimes see competitors already have 5 rounds inside the magazine..either they put the rounds in so quick that by the time the word "load" is barely finished the rounds are already in, or the rounds are already in the first place. So I can only see the competitor put his magazine inside the pistol.

8.7.6.2.c "“LOAD.” In all 25m Training or Qualification events, only one (1) magazine or pistol may be loaded with not more than five (5) cartridges on the command “LOAD.” Nothing else is allowed to be inserted into the magazine or cylinder;"

8.7.6.2.d "If an athlete loads his pistol with more cartridges than he is allowed to load (full series or series completion) or he loads more than one (1) magazine on any command “LOAD” he must be penalized by the deduction of two (2) points for each additional cartridge and each additional magazine from his competition score in that same series;"

It's different for the RFP final:-

Part of 6.17.5.g "After the command “LOAD,” athletes have one (1) min to load two (2) magazines (Rule 8.7.6.2 d does not apply for Finals). Only one (1) “LOAD” command is given before the start of the first MATCH series. During the entire Finals, athletes may continue to load magazines as required."

[David Levene]

Also, if 2. can you load 10 rounds 10 round magazines so you can go through 2 strings? So when the first string is finished you merely drop the magazine off and wait for the command and pop it back in for the next string..or you do not even need to drop the magazine off but merely put the pistol down and open the breech and put a safety flag in...

Even if that was allowed, which it certainly isn't, round 6 would be in the chamber.

[David M]

You have also posted in the Bulleye forum so....
What event's are we talking about ?
ISSF is different to WA1500, Service, Action or Bullseye.
Refer to the rules for each match.

[conradin]

I put the same question on both ISSF and Bullseye, since they are different type of competition, despite the similarities.

8.7.6.2.c "“LOAD.” In all 25m Training or Qualification events, only one (1) magazine or pistol may be loaded with not more than five (5) cartridges on the command “LOAD.” Nothing else is allowed to be inserted into the magazine or cylinder;"

1. When command is given...competitor begins to put round after round into his magazine until all five of them are in, then put the magazine into the pistol?
2. When the command is given, competitor begins to put the entire speed loader (already have five rounds in it) on top of the cylinder and drop the rounds (CFP).?

8.7.6.2.d "If an athlete loads his pistol with more cartridges than he is allowed to load (full series or series completion) or he loads more than one (1) magazine on any command “LOAD” he must be penalized by the deduction of two (2) points for each additional cartridge and each additional magazine from his competition score in that same series;"

After the shots are finished, or during the loading? If during loading, a competitor puts six into the magazine, then pull it back out when he realized his mistake, before actual shooting begins, is he ok?

Part of 6.17.5.g "After the command “LOAD,” athletes have one (1) min to load two (2) magazines (Rule 8.7.6.2 d does not apply for Finals). Only one (1) “LOAD” command is given before the start of the first MATCH series. During the entire Finals, athletes may continue to load magazines as required."

That might have been why I saw competitor already has one magazine loaded already.
Does this rule apply to ALL Finals or just RFP finals?

[David M]

"2. When the command is given, competitor begins to put the entire speed loader (already have five rounds in it) on top of the cylinder and drop the rounds (CFP).?"

Speedloader's are not normally used in ISSF, revolvers are loaded after the command load from the box.
If a speedloader (or moonclip) was required it would be need to be loaded after the command load, then loaded in the revolver.
I don't think the referee would allow pre loaded speed loaders or moonclips.

[David Levene]

I put the same question on both ISSF and Bullseye, since they are different type of competition, despite the similarities.

8.7.6.2.c "“LOAD.” In all 25m Training or Qualification events, only one (1) magazine or pistol may be loaded with not more than five (5) cartridges on the command “LOAD.” Nothing else is allowed to be inserted into the magazine or cylinder;"

1. When command is given...competitor begins to put round after round into his magazine until all five of them are in, then put the magazine into the pistol?
2. When the command is given, competitor begins to put the entire speed loader (already have five rounds in it) on top of the cylinder and drop the rounds (CFP).?

1. Yes
2. You can use a speed loader in ISSF, but why on earth would you want to. You've got a minute to load.

8.7.6.2.d "If an athlete loads his pistol with more cartridges than he is allowed to load (full series or series completion) or he loads more than one (1) magazine on any command “LOAD” he must be penalized by the deduction of two (2) points for each additional cartridge and each additional magazine from his competition score in that same series;"

After the shots are finished, or during the loading? If during loading, a competitor puts six into the magazine, then pull it back out when he realized his mistake, before actual shooting begins, is he ok?

It would be a very harsh Jury member who penalized a competitor who puts 6 in a magazine by mistake and then immediately takes one out. I would only really penalise someone if the magazine had 6 in when it was put into the gun.

Part of 6.17.5.g "After the command “LOAD,” athletes have one (1) min to load two (2) magazines (Rule 8.7.6.2 d does not apply for Finals). Only one (1) “LOAD” command is given before the start of the first MATCH series. During the entire Finals, athletes may continue to load magazines as required."

That might have been why I saw competitor already has one magazine loaded already.
Does this rule apply to ALL Finals or just RFP finals?

Sorry, I should have referred to 6.17.4.g for the RFP final. There is a similar exemption in 6.17.5.g for the 25m Pistol Women final.

edit note: Full ISSF rules assume that finals will be shot on electronics (as they must be in ISSF Championships). If someone is foolhardy enough to try running them on paper targets, where staff will need to go forward to score, then don't expect to be allowed to have loaded magazines on the bench.

[CR10X]

Also, if 2. can you load 10 rounds 10 round magazines so you can go through 2 strings? So when the first string is finished you merely drop the magazine off and wait for the command and pop it back in for the next string..or you do not even need to drop the magazine off but merely put the pistol down and open the breech and put a safety flag in...

Any NRA Certified Pistol instructor should know where round 6 is and where it will wind up if someone was to do this! Time for a refresher?