Hi all,
My first post here; I'm a total beginner shooter; I'll soon be getting (most likely) a Avanti 753 Elite to shoot targets in my garage. I'm 49 years, 6'1" tall. Could you please direct me to a good guide for basic info ie stance, breathing, technique in general. I'd appreciate ANY info offered.
I've read what I could find for reviews at a few AG dealers and that's how I choose the 753; everybody says it's "very accurate" so I'm guessing "trigger creep" is annoying but can be successfully lived with for a while anyway. I figure it can't be a bad thing to have the 753 to learn on and move up from there if merited. I don't know anything about using/filling a PCP with a pump- would love to hear feedback on that. Are Airforce Edge & Crossman Challenger 2009 better alternatives to the 753?
I'll set up an indoor/outdoor range in my garage. I've got 26 to 28' or so totally indoor and the full 10m if I open the door and step outside a few feet. Will shooting at the shorter distance be a bad thing?
Sorry for the run on post. Please chime in with anything you've got, thanks so much.
Direct a total beginner please.
Moderators: pilkguns, Marcus, m1963, David Levene, Spencer
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Fatman
Avanti 753
Hi toddinjax:
The Avanti 753 is a great starter rifle. They are relatively inexpensive, very accurate, easy and inexpensicve to rebuild if and when the time comes. They're legal for use in competition. (Be sure to check the rear sight for play. There have been some issues with excessive play. If you get one that's loose, or that binds, contact Daisy customer service. They'll see you right.)
They are especially good for offhand (standing) shooting as the single pump stroke is not difficult and doesn't require totally rebuilding your position for each shot. They are more problematic in 3 position as pumping requires breaking and rebuilding your position with every shot.
That being said, a lot of 3 position competitions have been won with them as well as with the less expesive Avanti 853 (which lacks the "Target" style stock and the more refined sights).
As an SSP (Single Stroke Pnuematic) they are self contained and require no additional complicated and expensive equipment. Do the Pilkington (our host) trigger tune and you can get a very good trigger. Information is on their site.
Good pellets are a must if you are serious. Try a selection of H&N, Vogel, Daisy Avanti, JSB and Beeman target (Wadcutter) pellets to see which shoot best in you rifle.
The best coach you can get without actually having one is the book "Ways of the Rifle" About $65 (from our host if memory serves). It will answer most of your questions and some you haven't even thought of yet. For the information it provides, it's a bargain!
It's best to shoot regulation targets at the full 10 meter distance and to have the target at the correct height. It should be well lit. This is especially important if you intend to compete in matches. "Train the way you compete"
If your interest holds and as you improve you may want to step up to the way more expensive "Precision" match rifles available from FWB, Walther, Beeman etc. They are very expensive ($1,500 and up to over $3,000)and require support equipment. You will also need the proper clothing, shoes, pants, coat, glove, sling, sweater etc. to be competetive in todays world. It would also be a good time to get a qualified coach if you want to go anywhere in competition.
Hope this helps.
Fatman
The Avanti 753 is a great starter rifle. They are relatively inexpensive, very accurate, easy and inexpensicve to rebuild if and when the time comes. They're legal for use in competition. (Be sure to check the rear sight for play. There have been some issues with excessive play. If you get one that's loose, or that binds, contact Daisy customer service. They'll see you right.)
They are especially good for offhand (standing) shooting as the single pump stroke is not difficult and doesn't require totally rebuilding your position for each shot. They are more problematic in 3 position as pumping requires breaking and rebuilding your position with every shot.
That being said, a lot of 3 position competitions have been won with them as well as with the less expesive Avanti 853 (which lacks the "Target" style stock and the more refined sights).
As an SSP (Single Stroke Pnuematic) they are self contained and require no additional complicated and expensive equipment. Do the Pilkington (our host) trigger tune and you can get a very good trigger. Information is on their site.
Good pellets are a must if you are serious. Try a selection of H&N, Vogel, Daisy Avanti, JSB and Beeman target (Wadcutter) pellets to see which shoot best in you rifle.
The best coach you can get without actually having one is the book "Ways of the Rifle" About $65 (from our host if memory serves). It will answer most of your questions and some you haven't even thought of yet. For the information it provides, it's a bargain!
It's best to shoot regulation targets at the full 10 meter distance and to have the target at the correct height. It should be well lit. This is especially important if you intend to compete in matches. "Train the way you compete"
If your interest holds and as you improve you may want to step up to the way more expensive "Precision" match rifles available from FWB, Walther, Beeman etc. They are very expensive ($1,500 and up to over $3,000)and require support equipment. You will also need the proper clothing, shoes, pants, coat, glove, sling, sweater etc. to be competetive in todays world. It would also be a good time to get a qualified coach if you want to go anywhere in competition.
Hope this helps.
Fatman
I disagree with Fatman about shooting the full 10m. If you've only got 26ft, that's fine. The center is still the center. Sure, you might drop a point or two more 5ft further away, but techniques is what you need to focus on first.
I'm also a little worried that Ways of the Rifle will throw you for a loop. It is a highly detailed book, though you should go ahead and buy it because it is an excellent publication. You might also get the Air Rifle Shooting version as well, though I haven't gotten a look at that one yet. Problem is a short search through the internet later, and I can't find the book I'm looking for. It's a touch old, and I can't remember the title, but will get you concentrating on the fundamentals. I'll keep looking for it.
Good luck.
I'm also a little worried that Ways of the Rifle will throw you for a loop. It is a highly detailed book, though you should go ahead and buy it because it is an excellent publication. You might also get the Air Rifle Shooting version as well, though I haven't gotten a look at that one yet. Problem is a short search through the internet later, and I can't find the book I'm looking for. It's a touch old, and I can't remember the title, but will get you concentrating on the fundamentals. I'll keep looking for it.
Good luck.
Whichever way you end up going with a rifle if you have never shot before it would be wise to get someone that does shoot well to give you instruction even if only a couple of times. Better to start off trying to do things right instead of developing bad habits that are harder to break once they are ingrained in your technique.
The Daisy is a good little rifle but I would also look at possibly getting a FWB300 for just a little bit more used. They are older rifles but solid as a rock with great triggers and all self contained. Lots of parts if you need them and it will feel more like a real rifle in your hands. Plus if you ever decide to sell it your likely to get most of your money back.
Bo
The Daisy is a good little rifle but I would also look at possibly getting a FWB300 for just a little bit more used. They are older rifles but solid as a rock with great triggers and all self contained. Lots of parts if you need them and it will feel more like a real rifle in your hands. Plus if you ever decide to sell it your likely to get most of your money back.
Bo
I would recommend any of the older used spring or better yet the SSP match rifles, they would be a huge step up from the 753.
The TAU-200 is also another rifle to look at. I think you can use standard co2 cartridges in them, so you do not have to deal with bulk co2 if you don't want to. And you can find the TAU-200s used, which reduces their cost.
I also recommend that you get a back belt from Home Depot. This will help to support your lower back with the weight of the full size match rifles. The belt is not competition legal, but for casual use at home it is just fine. I have an injured back and I have to use the back belt to shoot my air rifles.
If you get the 753, I recommend that you get this booklet from the CMP.
https://estore.odcmp.com/store/catalog/ ... ote5=&max=
It has the trigger mods to fix the trigger. There are 3 mods, and IMHO the most important is to deburr the trigger sear. The burrs make it feel like you are dragging a 2x4 over an asphalt road, and you will be fighting the trigger when you should be concentrating on the target.
BTW as for trigger creep. I was brought up on the US ideal "breaking glass rod" trigger. I now like a "rolling" trigger, which some would call a lot of creep. You will get used to whichever trigger you have.
As for help.
First I recommend that you find a rifle coach and get a few sessions to get the basics correct. It is a LOT easier to get the basics correct first than to have to fix them later. I went to a coach to 'fix' my really lousy shooting, he totally rebuilt my stance and that dramatically improved my shooting. I went from struggling to keep the shots on the target paper itself (yeah that bad) to being able to keep my shots inside the black rings.
Only if you just cannot get a coach, then fall back on the books. The problem with learning from a book is that you cannot see yourself. You cannot see if your stance is correct or not, you need another (preferably experienced) person to look at you.
I would get the books anyway, I did.
I got both books (Ways of the Rifle and Air Rifle Shooting) from Pilkingtons. I can't say which is better, I get good info out of both..
http://www.pilkguns.com/books.shtml
The TAU-200 is also another rifle to look at. I think you can use standard co2 cartridges in them, so you do not have to deal with bulk co2 if you don't want to. And you can find the TAU-200s used, which reduces their cost.
I also recommend that you get a back belt from Home Depot. This will help to support your lower back with the weight of the full size match rifles. The belt is not competition legal, but for casual use at home it is just fine. I have an injured back and I have to use the back belt to shoot my air rifles.
If you get the 753, I recommend that you get this booklet from the CMP.
https://estore.odcmp.com/store/catalog/ ... ote5=&max=
It has the trigger mods to fix the trigger. There are 3 mods, and IMHO the most important is to deburr the trigger sear. The burrs make it feel like you are dragging a 2x4 over an asphalt road, and you will be fighting the trigger when you should be concentrating on the target.
BTW as for trigger creep. I was brought up on the US ideal "breaking glass rod" trigger. I now like a "rolling" trigger, which some would call a lot of creep. You will get used to whichever trigger you have.
As for help.
First I recommend that you find a rifle coach and get a few sessions to get the basics correct. It is a LOT easier to get the basics correct first than to have to fix them later. I went to a coach to 'fix' my really lousy shooting, he totally rebuilt my stance and that dramatically improved my shooting. I went from struggling to keep the shots on the target paper itself (yeah that bad) to being able to keep my shots inside the black rings.
Only if you just cannot get a coach, then fall back on the books. The problem with learning from a book is that you cannot see yourself. You cannot see if your stance is correct or not, you need another (preferably experienced) person to look at you.
I would get the books anyway, I did.
I got both books (Ways of the Rifle and Air Rifle Shooting) from Pilkingtons. I can't say which is better, I get good info out of both..
http://www.pilkguns.com/books.shtml
Congratulations on starting a new lifetime sport. The 753 is a great rifle, especially if you do the trigger modifications mentioned. Beginning instruction books are available from CMP (http://www.odcmp.com/Programs/publications.htm) for the Rifle Instruction Guide; or NRA (http://materials.nrahq.org/go/products. ... t=G-Books0 for EM 09450 Junior Rifle Marksmanship. Both are under $10, and give good basics.
As you advance you'll want Ways of the Rifle, and probably a good used SSP rifle.
As stated, a coach is important if you can find one in your area. Check with NRA or USA Shooting for a listing of coaches.
Good luck.
As you advance you'll want Ways of the Rifle, and probably a good used SSP rifle.
As stated, a coach is important if you can find one in your area. Check with NRA or USA Shooting for a listing of coaches.
Good luck.