hand pump question

[John M.]

I'm looking at getting a LP10 and use a hand pump with it. It seems like it's more popular to have your own scuba tank at home to refill the cylinders but I don't live very close to any scuba stores so refilling the tank is long drive. The Hill hand pump has a pressure gauge so I'm figuring it might work out. What are your recommendations and why?

Thanks in advance!

[Mike M.]

I have a Hill pump. Excellent piece of equipment. It's a workout, though. Best to pump after you shoot.

[Chicken-Farmer]

I have been using a hand pump for the last 8 years. The process of pumping does require some effort, but it is nothing to be afraid of. The small cylinders of the LP10 require a lot less effort than the larger tanks found on rifles. In theory you will only be required to fill the tanks from empty once because you will never "shoot" the tank empty as accuracy will eventually drop off as the tank nears empty. With a fully charged tank your LP10 will get about 170 full power shots before being required to be refilled. I don't know about you, but my poor arm can't stand that much shooting in one sitting!
Just remember to take things slow to reduce heat build-up in your pump. Heat creates condensed air, and condensed air creates condensation that you don't want inside your tank. I can easily fill my LP10 tanks without heating my pump up very much.

Chicken-Farmer

[Gwhite]

I have a Hill pump with the dessicant cartridge system. It works great, but it's definitely a good idea to plan ahead & pump well before you shoot.

[Mike M.]

FWIW, I pump while watching TV. Pump ten or twenty strokes during commercials. Works fine.

[RobStubbs]

The pumps can and do introduce moisture as as mentioned it condenses out from the air - scuba air is dry. You need to regularly bleed out the water from the pumps and I tend to leave mine with the drain screw out most of the time - I rarely use mine as also have a scuba tank, and the exercise of turning on and off the valve is just about right for me :)

Rob.

[Guest]

Hmmm, I didn't know about the water issue with pumps.

What exactly does water in the cylinders do the gun, cylinder, etc? If you get water in the cylinder, how do you get it out? And how do you know if you get water in the cylinder, is there a way to check for it?

[Hemmers]

Theoretically not too much to the cylinders, as they are usually stainless steel/anti-rust treated. You can also pump in airborne dust particles and so on - whatever the surrounding air is composed of as you pump will end up in the cylinder to some extent.

The cylinders should be ok, but water and anything else will be carried through the gun itself, which can damage seals, o-rings and the valves.
The only way to drain it, as Rob says is to completely empty the cylinder and allow whatever's in it to drain.
You don't need any way to ascertain if it's getting in there. If you pump directly from the atmosphere then you will pump in water vapour in the air unless you live somewhere with absolute zero humidity!
Scuba tanks really are the way to go if you can. Mechanised pump (i.e. no effort!), filters and dries the air for you. You take away a charged tank and just charge the cylinder as you need it.

[tenex]

Hi John,
I have a Hill pump and if I run down a cylinder to my lower limit (around 50 BAR) and pump it up the the max allowed by the pump (230 BAR, my cylinders will go to 250) it's a fair amount of work but perfectly doable. What I did last couple of times is just pump to 150 BAR, shoot a match, and swap cylinders. I get about 2 BAR per stroke, and about 1 bar per shot, so to refill after a match only takes 30 strokes or so, very manageable, and I have enough air for 100 shots or so, plenty for a match (and I have the other cylinder as well).

I find the force required to operate the pump above 200 BAR is a little tough on the wrists, but 150 is not much of a problem. After using the pump for a year, I would recommend it. My 15 year old can't use it however, he doesn't weigh enough (120 lbs) and can't pump without his feet coming off the ground. My understanding is the FX pump is a little easier, but requires more strokes (my friend has one, I may try to swap with him for a month or so).

Steve.

[Tolkach]

I use an LP-10 and have a Hill hand pump at home. I can charge my cylinders with scuba air at the local range, which usually is enough to carry me through practices at home. I'll occasionally use the pump, which works really well, and follow the Hill pump guide from our moderator's site.

I don't fret over moisture. I figure that properly bleeding the pump and cycling scuba air through the cylinders will keep moisture to a minimum.

Enjoy your LP-10!