Well into my retirement I started 10 m air pistol target shooting practice about 18 months back. I have done much reading and my monthly aggregate scores continue to improve, bit by bit. The one problem I have a hard time overcoming is my endless struggle with chicken finger.
I have one pistol, a Steyr LP10. An experienced fellow shooter suggested that I should get a multi-shot pistol with a heavier trigger and do fast timed shooting to deal with my problem.
Is this a viable approach?
OzzieM
Chicken finger
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Freepistol
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gordonfriesen
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Ozzie,
What has been said about timing and the psychological aspect is definitely correct. However, it is worth looking at the mechanics of your trigger pull to see whether you have the makings of a smooth straight pull.
It is this area which can be improved by using multiple rapid shots. Because you are firing faster, the finger has to move, and you can feel it moving from start to finish without any hangup in the middle. This is not at all like a hesitant precision shot in which you are avoiding final pressure until you are "sure". One of the coaches showcased on this site suggests that if you are having trouble with rapid fire, you should use a larger finger movement, meaning I guess, off the trigger to begin with, and then steady straight throught the trigger to the break without any stoppage on the way.
This is one part of the question then. You have to be able to move the finger without regrets and without looking back. The next point is how well that finger is moving. For that, you have had the best advice from Higgins--shoot on a blank target, and using the no pausing straight through trigger, watch the sights and make sure you are pulling back in such a way as to maintain the alignment right into the follow through.
This challenge is extreme. It puts all of your grip on the block. You have to be able to create an anvil for the hammer of your trigger finger. The grip must reinforce and not contradict the trigger finger. If this is not correct, then even though you have a good hold and alignment, when you start the finger, the alignment will change. This in turn will cause you to back off the trigger, perhaps slacken your wrist, and ultimately snatch the shot.
As stated, rapid fire is good for this. Also good is heavier triggers. Once again the helpful factor is a grosser movement, which if good, can then be scaled back to something more minimal.
One of my friends suggested that I establish my hold and then YANK the trigger. The implication is that if the sights stay aligned through that rough pull, then the underlying mechanism of grip and finger agreeing on the direction of pull, and the independence of the trigger finger must be ok. And as a corollary, if you can't maintain alignment while roughly manipulating the trigger, then there is something wrong with your mechanics.
This could be even more strongly stated in that jerking the trigger is not the actual error. A jerking trigger that is jerked properly, on the correct line and without disturbing the grip, will not put the gun out of alignment. And a jerk along with a bad shot is merely showcasing a bad grip and trigger finger combination. It is convenient to blame the shot on the jerk, but the real culprit is the faulty movement, not its speed.
And here is another common diagnostic test of your underlying movement: Pick up your gun, aim, start squeezing until you are squeezing much harder than you would have to actually shoot, then slow and easy, let off the pressure, and just as smoothly put it back on. Any normal untrained individual will feel a shift of presure from grip fingers to trigger and back, accompanied by gross movements of the front sight. Our job is learning to fluidly apply, reduce, re-apply and re-reduce trigger pressure without any sight movement at all. (Good Luck !)
It is my opinion that a lot of what we call "chicken finger" is an attempt to mask the evil movement of the front sight. To avoid seeing the alignment fall apart, we put on the pressure with exaggerated caution and even the fatal twitch at the end may be small enough to be hidden in the recoil.
My point though, is that the error is not at the end, in the acutal jerk. The error is at the beginning and in the middle because the finger is not actually moving. There are little incremental tightennings, each one beginning an alignment error, and then the alignment is corrected, and then there is another little tightenning jerk, and the last little jerk is the "chicken finger we are trying to avoid.
Be bold. PULL the trigger. And if the sight alignment goes to hell, try to figure out why. Assuming that your grip and finger agree, and that you are pulling on the right line, then there is no reason why the sight alignment should go south. On the other hand, the mechanical difficulty of moving one finger smoothly while the others retain a constant pressure is a very hard thing. And no discussion of the psychological dimension of chicken finger will allow you to avoid mastering this physical challenge.
The drills once again:
1. rapid fire.
2. double tap.
3. deliberately gross finger movement.
4. Heavy trigger (.38 .45).
4. Producing three or four squeezes one after another on a steadily held, uncocked gun to feel what the finger muscles are doing in the other fingers (is the grip changing?), and crucially, what are the sights doing while you increase and decrease pressure on the trigger?
5. All of the above on a blank target to maximize concentration
BTW. I am no expert. But I am passionate about this subject because it has caused me so much grief and I have spent a lot of thought and effort in my atempts to put it to bed. I hope some of this is helpful to you.
Best Regards,
Gordon
What has been said about timing and the psychological aspect is definitely correct. However, it is worth looking at the mechanics of your trigger pull to see whether you have the makings of a smooth straight pull.
It is this area which can be improved by using multiple rapid shots. Because you are firing faster, the finger has to move, and you can feel it moving from start to finish without any hangup in the middle. This is not at all like a hesitant precision shot in which you are avoiding final pressure until you are "sure". One of the coaches showcased on this site suggests that if you are having trouble with rapid fire, you should use a larger finger movement, meaning I guess, off the trigger to begin with, and then steady straight throught the trigger to the break without any stoppage on the way.
This is one part of the question then. You have to be able to move the finger without regrets and without looking back. The next point is how well that finger is moving. For that, you have had the best advice from Higgins--shoot on a blank target, and using the no pausing straight through trigger, watch the sights and make sure you are pulling back in such a way as to maintain the alignment right into the follow through.
This challenge is extreme. It puts all of your grip on the block. You have to be able to create an anvil for the hammer of your trigger finger. The grip must reinforce and not contradict the trigger finger. If this is not correct, then even though you have a good hold and alignment, when you start the finger, the alignment will change. This in turn will cause you to back off the trigger, perhaps slacken your wrist, and ultimately snatch the shot.
As stated, rapid fire is good for this. Also good is heavier triggers. Once again the helpful factor is a grosser movement, which if good, can then be scaled back to something more minimal.
One of my friends suggested that I establish my hold and then YANK the trigger. The implication is that if the sights stay aligned through that rough pull, then the underlying mechanism of grip and finger agreeing on the direction of pull, and the independence of the trigger finger must be ok. And as a corollary, if you can't maintain alignment while roughly manipulating the trigger, then there is something wrong with your mechanics.
This could be even more strongly stated in that jerking the trigger is not the actual error. A jerking trigger that is jerked properly, on the correct line and without disturbing the grip, will not put the gun out of alignment. And a jerk along with a bad shot is merely showcasing a bad grip and trigger finger combination. It is convenient to blame the shot on the jerk, but the real culprit is the faulty movement, not its speed.
And here is another common diagnostic test of your underlying movement: Pick up your gun, aim, start squeezing until you are squeezing much harder than you would have to actually shoot, then slow and easy, let off the pressure, and just as smoothly put it back on. Any normal untrained individual will feel a shift of presure from grip fingers to trigger and back, accompanied by gross movements of the front sight. Our job is learning to fluidly apply, reduce, re-apply and re-reduce trigger pressure without any sight movement at all. (Good Luck !)
It is my opinion that a lot of what we call "chicken finger" is an attempt to mask the evil movement of the front sight. To avoid seeing the alignment fall apart, we put on the pressure with exaggerated caution and even the fatal twitch at the end may be small enough to be hidden in the recoil.
My point though, is that the error is not at the end, in the acutal jerk. The error is at the beginning and in the middle because the finger is not actually moving. There are little incremental tightennings, each one beginning an alignment error, and then the alignment is corrected, and then there is another little tightenning jerk, and the last little jerk is the "chicken finger we are trying to avoid.
Be bold. PULL the trigger. And if the sight alignment goes to hell, try to figure out why. Assuming that your grip and finger agree, and that you are pulling on the right line, then there is no reason why the sight alignment should go south. On the other hand, the mechanical difficulty of moving one finger smoothly while the others retain a constant pressure is a very hard thing. And no discussion of the psychological dimension of chicken finger will allow you to avoid mastering this physical challenge.
The drills once again:
1. rapid fire.
2. double tap.
3. deliberately gross finger movement.
4. Heavy trigger (.38 .45).
4. Producing three or four squeezes one after another on a steadily held, uncocked gun to feel what the finger muscles are doing in the other fingers (is the grip changing?), and crucially, what are the sights doing while you increase and decrease pressure on the trigger?
5. All of the above on a blank target to maximize concentration
BTW. I am no expert. But I am passionate about this subject because it has caused me so much grief and I have spent a lot of thought and effort in my atempts to put it to bed. I hope some of this is helpful to you.
Best Regards,
Gordon
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deadeyedick
- Posts: 1198
- Joined: Thu Jan 24, 2008 5:55 pm
- Location: Australia
In yur'yevs comprehensive book describing every aspect of pistol shooting, he outlines the accepted techniques for trigger release, it seems that there are two accepted methods of trigger pull.
One is the continual committment to trigger release, and shot release hopefully within 4-6 seconds [ which is where most settling of the hold occurs ]
Two is for more experienced shooters, and it is a gradual pulsing of the trigger pressure during the settling period. If your sight picture moves radically, then back off a bit, resuming when a more controlled settling is evident. This works best for me.
If you can get hold of a copy of this book, then read yur'yevs description.
One of these two techniques will work better for you than the other. Remember to stick with feels most comfortable, and refine it, gradually becoming more comfortable.
One is the continual committment to trigger release, and shot release hopefully within 4-6 seconds [ which is where most settling of the hold occurs ]
Two is for more experienced shooters, and it is a gradual pulsing of the trigger pressure during the settling period. If your sight picture moves radically, then back off a bit, resuming when a more controlled settling is evident. This works best for me.
If you can get hold of a copy of this book, then read yur'yevs description.
One of these two techniques will work better for you than the other. Remember to stick with feels most comfortable, and refine it, gradually becoming more comfortable.
Last edited by deadeyedick on Tue Mar 03, 2009 5:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Chicken finger
I have my work cut out for me. Overcoming my hesitant trigger finger is important to me - it is the key to progressing further as a precision target shooter. This being my main hobby I certainly do not begrudge the time and effort involved.
Your responses make me realize once more what a wonderful community this is, willing to freely share expertise and advice. Thank you Rob, David, Freepistol and Gordon.
Oswald
Your responses make me realize once more what a wonderful community this is, willing to freely share expertise and advice. Thank you Rob, David, Freepistol and Gordon.
Oswald
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Steve Swartz as Guest
Ozzie:
One other input FWIW.
"Checken Finger" results from a shooter looking at the target adn sights instead of just the sights. The shooter is trying to "line up" the rear sight, the front sight, and the target all at the same time.
That is impossible- and leads to the development of a whole host of very, very bad habits ("chicken finger" will be the *least* of your problems if you don't break this problem *fast*).
So
Immediately stop shooting at targets with the "Distraction Bull."
Dry fire- Dry fire against a neutral surface- and repeat.
Work on ALIGNMENT and smooth, straight, rapid, consistent trigger manipulation that does not disturb the ALIGNMENT.
Dry fire, and dry fire against a neutral surface some more.
As you develop confidence in your alignment/triggering skills, begin introducing live fire against a neutral surface.
GET THE BULL OUT OF YOUR TRAINING!
Steve Swartz
[that fuzzy black dot out there provides ABSOLUTELY NO USEFUL INFORMATION at all]
One other input FWIW.
"Checken Finger" results from a shooter looking at the target adn sights instead of just the sights. The shooter is trying to "line up" the rear sight, the front sight, and the target all at the same time.
That is impossible- and leads to the development of a whole host of very, very bad habits ("chicken finger" will be the *least* of your problems if you don't break this problem *fast*).
So
Immediately stop shooting at targets with the "Distraction Bull."
Dry fire- Dry fire against a neutral surface- and repeat.
Work on ALIGNMENT and smooth, straight, rapid, consistent trigger manipulation that does not disturb the ALIGNMENT.
Dry fire, and dry fire against a neutral surface some more.
As you develop confidence in your alignment/triggering skills, begin introducing live fire against a neutral surface.
GET THE BULL OUT OF YOUR TRAINING!
Steve Swartz
[that fuzzy black dot out there provides ABSOLUTELY NO USEFUL INFORMATION at all]
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deadeyedick
- Posts: 1198
- Joined: Thu Jan 24, 2008 5:55 pm
- Location: Australia
Chicken finger
Thank you, Steve. Practically all the causes of chicken finger enumerated in your post and the others definitely apply to me. While practice is not as much fun as doing the real thing, finding your real potential based on hard and smart work is in the end the most rewarding part of precision shooting. As I pointed out somewhere above, I have my work cut out for me and I will follow the recommended exercises. Again, THANK YOU!
Ozzie
Ozzie